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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 2272740" data-attributes="member: 2011">Range has been an issue in about one combat in three or four for both psions in our group since level one.Looking at this on paper, I can see where people wouldn't think that it is a big deal. In an actual game though, it comes up.It's a weakness, no doubt about it.The self buffing powers are good. But, they do not make up for the fact that arcane caster can "disappear" from the battlefield completely and still be a factor in the battle.There is a major difference between boosting a save by two and being hard or impossible to target by opponents.I actually meant "some exceptions" to 11th level psions (like the 7th level Nomad or Egoist).Compared to Dominate Person where you do not have to concentrate on it and it lasts one day per level?Granted, they errata-ed it, but Telepaths should have the advantage here and even with the errata, arcane casters have a duration advantage for a few levels.What I find interesting is that when a power is weaker than a spell, people think it's unimportant. When a power is greater than a spell, people think it's important.When a spell exists and a power does not, it's unimportant. When a power exists and a spell does not, it's important.Why is that?If you say so. I was just pointing out where psions were weaker. This is one.The point is that a psion buffing his weak ability scores does not gain anything. An arcane caster buffing the strong ability scores of fellow PCs gains a LOT in many circumstances.Increasing the AC of the Rogue by 2 when the Rogue already has the highest AC in the party allows the Rogue to hold off an enemy for a while.Increasing the to hit and damage of the Fighter by 2 (or 3 for damage with a two handed weapon) allows the Fighter to more easily bypass Damage Reduction and to take out opponents faster.Here you are just incorrect. A prepared arcane caster can be immune to summoned monsters or manifested constructs and he can make the rest of his allies immune as well. A psion has no powers to be immune to these. Having a complete defense against an entire type of spells/powers is not weak.The difference is that the Globe spells outright stop a large number of psionic powers. Defense is big in the game, especially in save or die type situations. Arcane casters have better defensive spells (except for AC boosting) and hence, can survive easier.You seem to blow off defensive spells/powers as no big deal. That's an error. Defensive spells / power make / break the game.Again not true. Multi-opponent area effect movement limiting spells easily change the course of battle and they even do so at high level. They can sometimes even result in TPK. This is huge, but you pretend that it is nothing.Or anyone else's character for that matter.If you say so. I rarely play a human.Nope. Only the ones with Mass in their name. I also did not include the vast number of area effects spells. There are only a few area effect powers.All in all, the edge in affecting more than one opponent goes to arcane casters.The lists are different lengths though and one has a restriction and the other does not. Hence, a disadvantage. Not necessarily a huge disadvantage, but one nonetheless.</blockquote>

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