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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 2276239" data-attributes="member: 3146">I'm rather surprised that the discussion--which was initially the balance of psionics in general--has come down to just psion vs. sorceror or psion vs. wizard.The 3.0 haste example is a good one. The 3.5 change didn't just affect casters who could no longer pump out two spells per round. It also had a big impact on melee fighters who could no longer partial charge+full attack. (In fact, it was that ability that my wizard used it for most often in 3.0 since tripling the power of our 6th-7th level fighters didn't use up my other spells). Psions with schism have some of the spellcasting power provided by 3.0 haste. What is less noted, however, is that psiwarriors (and illithid slayers and warminds if a PC can figure a way to get into those classes without psiwarrior levels) re-introduce the melee version of 3.0 haste with hustle and psionic lion's charge. Especially at high levels, the difference between being able to make a full attack and being limited to standard attack is tremendous. Now, Scion and I have had this out previously comparing the psywar to the fighter class and I still think that those two classes are at least in the same ballpark (barring absurd abusiveness like the skin of the proteus). However, the real difference is not going to be between the Fighter 20 and the PsyWar 20. Instead, it's between the fighter 12/PsyWar 4/Warmind 4 or the Fighter 6/Warmind 10 (who somehow talked his DM into Knowledge Psionics as a class skill) and the fighter 20. Even the fighter 16/Psy War 4 gains a huge advantage by being able to make a full attack after moving--so much of one, that I would expect nearly every fighter build in a world with psionics to inlcude some way to get either hustle or psionic lion's charge or a similar ability. [Even if it's only once or twice per day, it's still worth it].</blockquote>

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