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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Scurvy_Platypus" data-source="post: 4470718" data-attributes="member: 43283">Well, in defense of your GM, up until now every time you used something like Force Choke/Grip in a Star Wars game it was a Dark Side point. Period.And the two previous incarnations of the Star Wars game by WotC have it that way as well.You might not like it, you might think it's not fair, you might think it's stupid... but there's a long history for it being that way. There really wasn't any moral relativism. You did good things, or you did bad things and that was it.Now, you say you think it should be "situational". Let's be honest here, there's probably going to almost never be a situation where you're going to qualify for it, because you're going to make sure that you keep force gripping people "for a good reason".I'm going to guess that you've been using force grip a fair amount; enough that it's bugging the GM. You say it's only "sometimes"; well, "sometimes" is in the eye of the beholder. You might not think it's very often, but I'm willing to bet that the GM feels like you use it at least once just about every fight.So in an attempt to rein you in and feel like he's got some control (or a chance to challenge you in a fight without running the risk of killing the other characters), he's decided to go with an old-school interpretation of force grip.And the entry here doesn't really make Force Grip sound like a completely neutral power either:<a href="http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Force_Grip" target="_blank">Telekinesis - Wookieepedia, the Star Wars Wiki</a>At the end of the day, you're wanting to rule-lawyer this. I'm not sure how ENWorld is going to help you too much with this, unless your GM is really going to be persuaded by you saying, "Dude, I went online to a forum, and all the people there totally think I shouldn't get Dark Side points for Force Gripping someone."You'd be a lot better served doing one of two things:1. Respect the GM's decision and abide by what he's decided2. Accept that the GM feels you've been abusing the power, and see if you can negotiate a limited use of it without incurring Dark Side points. Something like, "one use per game session" or "one use every other game session" for "free" (no Dark Side points) or something along those lines.I'm not trying to sound like a jerk here, it just seems like a pretty clear case of a player saying, "I want things my way" and the GM saying, "No." Arguing with him about it isn't going to change his mind, it's just going to piss him off. And if you eventually batter him down with rule lawyering and "logical" arguements, then one of two things is probably going to happen.A) He'll start looking for ways to screw your character. Preferably using the rules, just so you have to suck it up.B) He's going to have less fun in running the game. Depending on the GM, this can mean either he'll burn-out quick and not want to run any more games, or he might just quit putting effort into the game.Disclaimer:I personally don't like Star Wars games. I recently agreed to play in a Star Wars game for the first time in... 7 or 8 years. It's the d6 system (as usual), and as usual I am not playing any kind of Force user or Force sensitive or anything like that. My standard request when someone asks me if I want to play in a Star Wars game is, "Can I be a Jawa jedi?" How the GM reacts tells me whether I should even bother joining the game or not. Surprisingly, this GM said, "If someone hadn't already asked to be a Failed Jedi, I'd totally let you do that." So I agreed to join the game, and am now playing a bounty hunter named Sue; he's modeled after Jayne from Firefly.I understand how frustrating it is to have this picture of being a bad-ass jedi and how it's getting stomped down. I've spent 20 years playing fantasy games and I'm sick and tired of the level 1-5 "run from a rat" style of play that's _still_ popular. I just think you're going about this the wrong way.If you were just interested in being able to use Force Grip in a "stylish" fashion, then I'd suggest asking the GM if you could just use Force Grip as a "special effect". No mechanical benefit (knocking people down or whatever), just a way of being able to describe something a little bit cooler and give it that "jedi flair". In a game I'm currently running, one of the players is a dual hatchet wielding character. He doesn't get the _mechanical benefits_ of being a dual wielder (extra attacks or whatever), but it does mean he can describe cool stuff. He's happy with that, so I don't sweat it.</blockquote>

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