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[Forgotten Realms] The Wall of the Faithless
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<blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 6785485" data-attributes="member: 5834"><p>It is the direct power of their deity. The deity manifests his power through them. If they fail to serve him properly, he can remove their power at any time. Indirect would be you taking an action with his power. The priest is the indirect power of the deity. The spells he casts are the direct power of the deity.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Nearly every module or book I've read has some 3rd level or higher priest listed as part of the settlement. Cantrips are usable constantly. If nothing else, a cleric could do plenty in a day even when exhausted of spells.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Outrage? Gods do as they wish. People come back the next day. Gods don't operate on a human schedule. If they tell you they're done for the day, they're done for the day. If someone becomes outraged, they would be looked upon as a fool.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Atonement is a spell. Cleansing is a spell. I know clerics of Lathander wander the land healing people.</p><p>...</p><p></p><p></p><p>Even if they're getting paid, they're still performing a miracle. That miracle is witnessed on a daily basis with cleric spells being performed on a daily basis.</p><p>...</p><p></p><p></p><p>And a little book known as the <em>Faiths and Avatars</em> and other such books on religions now supersede what Ed wrote, which is more in line with historical churches than fantasy churches. Ed didn't much thought into the idea of churches with priests that wield a god's power if that is what wrote.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, they are not. Plenty of classed clergy run temples. They can and do perform spells, which are the manifestation of a deities power, on a daily basis. There are other books besides the one you cited with plenty of information about priests wandering about healing and doing other activities than delivering messages and acting as banks. That sounds more like churches of Waukeen than Churches of Lathander or Torm.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is distinguishable because the cleric or paladin ensures that it is such.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, it is not. There are other books than <em>Magic in the Realms</em>. There is also what is sensible. Just as in today's world priests, reverends, and the like publically preach faith and would, if they had power like D&D clerics, display that power often to ensure followers know the deity is acting on their behalf. Fact is Ed didn't think about <em>Forgotten Realms</em> religion very well. I'm glad others have done that for him in other books where clerics are extremely active and display the power of their deity. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Only if the priest or paladin isn't good at preaching. Let me see, priests and clerics have a much higher Charisma than most wizards, so I think they would be better at preaching. Fact is Ed Greenwood was never very good writing clerics and paladins. He loves his pet wizards and has always paid short shrift to the idea of truly empowered clerics and paladins serving their faith in a very potent and public manner. </p><p></p><p>Even if one goes solely off the mechanics of the game, people in the Realms would watch miracles by priests and paladins, publically displaying and preaching the power of their deity in combination. Though I don't have my <em>Faiths and Avatars</em> or other religious Realms books on me, we will have to disagree as to how D&D religion works, especially in a high magic world in the Realms. I see things very differently from Ed Greenwood. And having read tons of game books on the Realms with priests in nearly every settlement as well as the religious books, I can confidently say that the passages you cited contradict the way they built the world and how clerical magic works. Not to mention how priests would actually act if they had the real power of their deity flowing through them from prayer.</p><p></p><p>I see the Realms folk as seeing the display of power from the gods on a daily basis, even if it is a bunch of 1st level clerics casting cantrips or low level spells on a daily basis. I think they take it for granted.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celtavian, post: 6785485, member: 5834"] It is the direct power of their deity. The deity manifests his power through them. If they fail to serve him properly, he can remove their power at any time. Indirect would be you taking an action with his power. The priest is the indirect power of the deity. The spells he casts are the direct power of the deity. Nearly every module or book I've read has some 3rd level or higher priest listed as part of the settlement. Cantrips are usable constantly. If nothing else, a cleric could do plenty in a day even when exhausted of spells. Outrage? Gods do as they wish. People come back the next day. Gods don't operate on a human schedule. If they tell you they're done for the day, they're done for the day. If someone becomes outraged, they would be looked upon as a fool. Atonement is a spell. Cleansing is a spell. I know clerics of Lathander wander the land healing people. ... Even if they're getting paid, they're still performing a miracle. That miracle is witnessed on a daily basis with cleric spells being performed on a daily basis. ... And a little book known as the [i]Faiths and Avatars[/i] and other such books on religions now supersede what Ed wrote, which is more in line with historical churches than fantasy churches. Ed didn't much thought into the idea of churches with priests that wield a god's power if that is what wrote. No, they are not. Plenty of classed clergy run temples. They can and do perform spells, which are the manifestation of a deities power, on a daily basis. There are other books besides the one you cited with plenty of information about priests wandering about healing and doing other activities than delivering messages and acting as banks. That sounds more like churches of Waukeen than Churches of Lathander or Torm. It is distinguishable because the cleric or paladin ensures that it is such. No, it is not. There are other books than [i]Magic in the Realms[/i]. There is also what is sensible. Just as in today's world priests, reverends, and the like publically preach faith and would, if they had power like D&D clerics, display that power often to ensure followers know the deity is acting on their behalf. Fact is Ed didn't think about [i]Forgotten Realms[/i] religion very well. I'm glad others have done that for him in other books where clerics are extremely active and display the power of their deity. Only if the priest or paladin isn't good at preaching. Let me see, priests and clerics have a much higher Charisma than most wizards, so I think they would be better at preaching. Fact is Ed Greenwood was never very good writing clerics and paladins. He loves his pet wizards and has always paid short shrift to the idea of truly empowered clerics and paladins serving their faith in a very potent and public manner. Even if one goes solely off the mechanics of the game, people in the Realms would watch miracles by priests and paladins, publically displaying and preaching the power of their deity in combination. Though I don't have my [i]Faiths and Avatars[/i] or other religious Realms books on me, we will have to disagree as to how D&D religion works, especially in a high magic world in the Realms. I see things very differently from Ed Greenwood. And having read tons of game books on the Realms with priests in nearly every settlement as well as the religious books, I can confidently say that the passages you cited contradict the way they built the world and how clerical magic works. Not to mention how priests would actually act if they had the real power of their deity flowing through them from prayer. I see the Realms folk as seeing the display of power from the gods on a daily basis, even if it is a bunch of 1st level clerics casting cantrips or low level spells on a daily basis. I think they take it for granted. [/QUOTE]
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