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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 6315813" data-attributes="member: 82106">I see no indication that anyone has a problem with people playing differently or having different tastes. NOBODY BUT YOU ever brought up words like 'badwrongfun' or 'illigitimate', etc. ALL we pointed out was that it is ludicrously easy to say "eladrin don't use 2-sided through-door Victorian style keyholes" and it fixed a major part of the problem, along with a whole raft of other EXCEEDINGLY minor things that are at the level of stuff DM's decide on the fly every day. So we have come to the conclusion that the failure here was not of the GAME, but of the people playing it. They didn't take responsibility for their own fun and even try FEEBLY to make it work for them. When they have tried, at least a tiny bit, then I will stop dismissing their protestations and take them seriously. Until then telling us that we're accusing people of 'badwrongfun' is ridiculous. Its a horse you need to stop trying to ride, because it isn't going anywhere.I'm just having fun with it. Honestly, this is as you said a discussion of blink elves, not something to take seriously, so I tend to wax a bit silly at times.I think you just don't get the point here. It isn't about 'valid' or 'invalid' readings of the rules. Its about missing the whole POINT of the rules, which is to make a fun game. If the game wasn't fun then they needed to take charge and make some sort of change. The only reason I mentioned the interpretation of the rules was to illustrate how TRIVIAL the change need be, just interpreting an existing rule differently. If there is no wrong or right way to do that then why was it a barrier to the people having this complaint? In that sense YES THEY WERE WRONG because they interpreted it in an unfun (for them) way. What you will NEVER hear me saying is "calling it unfun is BS, they need to define fun just like I do". THAT would be me being an arse.Its so bizarre that you first say that if we tell people to reinterpret things in a fun way for them we're being insensitive clods who don't understand the different brands of fun, and then at the same time its all no big deal and we shouldn't make issue with something that WE DIDN'T COMPLAIN ABOUT TO START WITH. I have no stress on this subject, the guy that wrote the diatribe about how blink elves ruined his game is the one you need to be talking to. So, let me just say it again for clarity. The only way to 'play wrong' is to not have fun. If you are not having fun then you need to take charge of your fun and change something so that it is fun. In this case that would have been INCREDIBLY easy, to the point where the group had to almost go out of its way to have a bad time. This is their business, they have the 'right' to do whatever they want, but they don't have any business complaining about the game in this case. The complaint is ridiculous and specious. If it were a complaint about some fundamental aspect of 4e then it would be just "OK, you are entitled to your tastes in games, we disagree but that's cool". Can you grasp what I'm getting at here? It just seems to be rolling right off somehow. We aren't criticising anyone for their tastes. We ARE criticising them for their incredible unwillingness to own the consequences of their tastes and do something about it, and that's a perfectly legitimate thing to do.</blockquote>

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