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<blockquote data-quote="The_Gneech" data-source="post: 4529106" data-attributes="member: 6779">I can't actually address whether 4E can or can't -- I haven't studied the 4E skill system enough to say from direct experience. (1) I was primarily trying to address Mallus' question in regard to why having mechanics for &quot;non-combat&quot; skills matters to some people. The prevailing opinion seems to be that most non-combat stuff in 4E is more-or-less handwaved, with some people saying that's a bug and others saying it's a feature, but whether that's an accurate assessment or not, I don't myself know.I guess it boils down to, &quot;some people (myself) find the framework really helpful, while others find it a pain in the tuckus.&quot; My own opinion is that the easy way to please both camps is to include it, but not make a big deal about it, which is pretty much the approach 3E took. I love giving my 3E characters esoteric knowledge skills. If anything, I would have liked to have seen that system made more flexible -- perhaps give everybody a handful of &quot;Apprenticeship Development&quot; ranks that could be put in Knowledge or Profession (including Perform) skills for those who were interested, and be roundly ignored by those who don't want to bother with them.I imagine that would be an easy thing to house-rule into 4E, but from the POV of a compulsive &quot;quirky character builder,&quot; it would be nice not to have to.-The Gneech <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool&nbsp; &nbsp; :cool:"&nbsp; data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" />(1) My gripes with 4E, while there are many, are not particularly related to the skill system; aside from having been a bit too consolidated, it looks basically like the SWSE one, except without the customizable &quot;Knowledge&quot; catchall.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="The_Gneech, post: 4529106, member: 6779"] I can't actually address whether [I]4E[/I] can or can't -- I haven't studied the [I]4E[/I] skill system enough to say from direct experience. (1) I was primarily trying to address Mallus' question in regard to why having mechanics for "non-combat" skills matters to some people. The prevailing opinion seems to be that most non-combat stuff in [I]4E[/I] is more-or-less handwaved, with some people saying that's a bug and others saying it's a feature, but whether that's an accurate assessment or not, I don't myself know. I guess it boils down to, "some people (myself) find the framework really helpful, while others find it a pain in the tuckus." My own opinion is that the easy way to please both camps is to include it, but not make a big deal about it, which is pretty much the approach [i]3E[/i] took. I love giving my [i]3E[/i] characters esoteric knowledge skills. If anything, I would have liked to have seen that system made more flexible -- perhaps give everybody a handful of "Apprenticeship Development" ranks that could be put in Knowledge or Profession (including Perform) skills for those who were interested, and be roundly ignored by those who don't want to bother with them. I imagine that would be an easy thing to house-rule into [I]4E[/I], but from the POV of a compulsive "quirky character builder," it would be nice not to have to. -The Gneech :cool: (1) My gripes with [I]4E[/I], while there are many, are not particularly related to the skill system; aside from having been a bit [I]too[/I] consolidated, it looks basically like the [I]SWSE[/I] one, except without the customizable "Knowledge" catchall. [/QUOTE]

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