Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Forked Thread: PC concept limitations in 4e
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Lacyon" data-source="post: 4537613" data-attributes="member: 63046"><p>I think it depends a bit on why you wanted to play a Dragon Disciple, but I'd basically lay it out as a Paragon Path or Epic Destiny, or even both (WotC didn't really make any secret about the idea that Paragon Paths were meant to replace Prestige Classes). Alternatively, you can reflavor magic items or feats that give similar types of bonuses. (My preference would be to reflavor the magic item creation Ritual to be a Draconic Initiation Ritual and give you powers of equivalent level magic items - including use of slots - when you put the components in).</p><p> </p><p>Let's go through the class features and think about how to convert them:</p><p> </p><p>Bonus Spells: this replaces normal spellcaster progression in 3.x, but in 4E a caster would still be gaining spells as normal for his levels. Essentially, 4E gives you this for free, though you could add one or more arcane attack powers to the PP or ED.</p><p> </p><p>Natural Armor: Your character can take armor proficiency feats and "reflavor" them as natural scales (in my games, at least), using rituals that follow the magic item guidelines to improve them as you level. Or the Path could grant you an armor bonus of appropriate level.</p><p> </p><p>Natural Attacks: Increase the damage die/proficiency bonus of the characters unarmed strikes as one of his Paragon Path features (not a power). (Leave aside the exact amount for now - it's okay to scale this depending on how many feats the character spends, basing it on weapons the character is proficient with). Let these be enchanted by rituals if you want.</p><p> </p><p>Ability Boost: Increases to Strength, Con, and Int => greater HP, better attacks and defenses. You can represent these with damage bonuses, bonuses on Athletics and Endurance checks, more surges, increased surge value, and/or power(s) that let you heal yourself or gain temp hp. Alternatively, you take feats like Toughness and Skill Focus: Endurance to represent your Draconic Might.</p><p> </p><p>Breath Weapon: Encounter/Daily attack power from PP/ED. Scale to the level you want it to appear at. Alternatively, reflavor an existing wizard power to match.</p><p> </p><p>Blindsense: Utility power (or maybe even feature of an Epic Destiny - I don't have a good enough sense of epic-level 4E to balance this easily). Alternatively, you can take Skill Focus: Perception and we flavor it to be your improving Draconic Senses.</p><p> </p><p>Wings: Depending on the level, this could be an Encounter or Daily ability allowing flight (one move action for Encounter, up to 5 minutes for Daily), or even a flat Fly speed (again, balancing epic-level features with precision isn't something I'm prepared to do right away). Alternatively, you perform a Ritual and pay a cost based on <insert magic item that allows flying here>, we flavor it as wings, and you can fly as well as that item can. Improves as you perform further rituals to match the effects of better items.</p><p> </p><p>The Dragon Apotheosis is mostly dealt with by expanding on what's written above - more stat increases, more sensory ability (either power-based or reflavored feat/item based), immunities that 4E dragons don't have, resistance to breath weapon's damage type.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Lacyon, post: 4537613, member: 63046"] I think it depends a bit on why you wanted to play a Dragon Disciple, but I'd basically lay it out as a Paragon Path or Epic Destiny, or even both (WotC didn't really make any secret about the idea that Paragon Paths were meant to replace Prestige Classes). Alternatively, you can reflavor magic items or feats that give similar types of bonuses. (My preference would be to reflavor the magic item creation Ritual to be a Draconic Initiation Ritual and give you powers of equivalent level magic items - including use of slots - when you put the components in). Let's go through the class features and think about how to convert them: Bonus Spells: this replaces normal spellcaster progression in 3.x, but in 4E a caster would still be gaining spells as normal for his levels. Essentially, 4E gives you this for free, though you could add one or more arcane attack powers to the PP or ED. Natural Armor: Your character can take armor proficiency feats and "reflavor" them as natural scales (in my games, at least), using rituals that follow the magic item guidelines to improve them as you level. Or the Path could grant you an armor bonus of appropriate level. Natural Attacks: Increase the damage die/proficiency bonus of the characters unarmed strikes as one of his Paragon Path features (not a power). (Leave aside the exact amount for now - it's okay to scale this depending on how many feats the character spends, basing it on weapons the character is proficient with). Let these be enchanted by rituals if you want. Ability Boost: Increases to Strength, Con, and Int => greater HP, better attacks and defenses. You can represent these with damage bonuses, bonuses on Athletics and Endurance checks, more surges, increased surge value, and/or power(s) that let you heal yourself or gain temp hp. Alternatively, you take feats like Toughness and Skill Focus: Endurance to represent your Draconic Might. Breath Weapon: Encounter/Daily attack power from PP/ED. Scale to the level you want it to appear at. Alternatively, reflavor an existing wizard power to match. Blindsense: Utility power (or maybe even feature of an Epic Destiny - I don't have a good enough sense of epic-level 4E to balance this easily). Alternatively, you can take Skill Focus: Perception and we flavor it to be your improving Draconic Senses. Wings: Depending on the level, this could be an Encounter or Daily ability allowing flight (one move action for Encounter, up to 5 minutes for Daily), or even a flat Fly speed (again, balancing epic-level features with precision isn't something I'm prepared to do right away). Alternatively, you perform a Ritual and pay a cost based on <insert magic item that allows flying here>, we flavor it as wings, and you can fly as well as that item can. Improves as you perform further rituals to match the effects of better items. The Dragon Apotheosis is mostly dealt with by expanding on what's written above - more stat increases, more sensory ability (either power-based or reflavored feat/item based), immunities that 4E dragons don't have, resistance to breath weapon's damage type. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Forked Thread: PC concept limitations in 4e
Top