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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jephlewis" data-source="post: 4606781" data-attributes="member: 81304">The three core books retail for $105.00 and contain a total of 800 plus pages. This hypothetical 4E board game does not simply 'dress it in different clothes', but rather puts out a 'barely clothed' version with regards to rules, as well as a reduced price point.Quite a few people I know who have never gamed have expressed concern at how many rules they'd have to learn in order to play once I told them about the three core rule books. When I explained that most of it wasn't 'absolutely needed' to learn the game, they got excited again. Their reaction is part of the reason I think that the 4E starter set is a move in the right direction; another reason being the dungeon tiles and cardboard counters [that's why I bought three starter sets].At this point, I began to ponder to myself, "self, how can wotc improve on the desgin and the goal of the 4E starter set?". Please note, this is just what I think would help sell D&D to more people...1. Quick start rules are a must; the pre gens with pre selected powers are ideal. In the beginning, you'd want the customer to play the game as much as possible without having to learn 'what stacks with what' or how to optimize. 2. Short, to the point adventures tie in with point 1; the buyer doesn't need to learn how to build encounters just yet because there are some already done. 3. Multiple physical elements or 'fiddly bits'; the tiles, minis, and cards are all in this set to aid in getting a grasp of how the game works quicker, and they're 'neat'So, I think that this hypothetical board game would:Be 'built from' already made components for the rpg [quick start rules, dungeon tiles, minis, cards]Make 4E easier and quicker to learn [introduce people to 4E D&D]Sell 4E in toy stores wal mart, kmart, target, etc...Grow the gamer base [more players and DM's] by selling it in toy storesMake the game something that established gamers want for themselvesAdvertise the books in the board gameAccept the same accessories from the rpg line as newer ones come outWhich of these would the board game accomplish? Which of these would it fail to accomplish? To what degree? Is there a better way? Is there a LESS EXPENSIVE way?Never played runebound, but YES! How would you personally streamline 4E rules to achieve this?So, would you buy something like this? Do you think wotc could get new pnp gamers from something like this? Do you think it would sell in toy stores?1. Selling it in toy stores; wotc could reach a whole lot of people if their product was in target, kmart, wal mart, etc...2. quicker and faster, rules light intro to 4E for new people; because 800 pages of rules can be intimidating to some people.What do you think wotc should do to expand the 4E pnp rpg market? 1. Very simplified, yes; i'm right there with ya. I think the 4E starter was a good move by wotc.2. character on a single card; I think this would be a good idea too; counters could be used to track hit points, defenses, etc, so upgrading would be a matter of having 'two silver shields' on top of your AC defense score to note that your AC is now 30. How do you envision a single card character and upgrading it?3. I think an expansion that offered multiple cards and minis would sell better; i.e. instead of just the barbarian, wotc had a 'primal' expansion that contained ALL the primal heroes, some primal monsters/villains, primal quests [the aztec temple, the feywild cave], primal minis, and primal power/trap/monster/event cards. Heck, what about 'the isle of dread primal expansion pack'?You and me both! I've got descent, and I bought it JUST FOR the pieces to use in D&D. The fact that it's a whole board game by itself is just gravy.That being said, one of the things I DIDN'T like about it was lack of 3d scenery; I want 3d treasure chests and the like to 'dress up' the map. But it is indeed a mighty fine product.Not familiar with either, can you explain?The 'red box' I bought was in 1987 and had the 'elmore red dragon facing off against a warrior in blue', so I think the one you're referring to was from an earlier time. I think the adventure you're talking about is 'keep on the borderlands'?There were TWO 3.x 'basic sets'; one with a black dragon [I got a few of those], and one with a blue dragon [don't have it]. I gave one of the 'black dragon' basic sets to a friend for christmas in 2007, and him and his wife played it and liked it. They had never played D&D before, and I didn't run my friend through a sample game or anything; he did it all by himself.I do agree wotc would have to make this board game stand on it's own AND be compatible with 4E stuff to drop in. Even if someone bought the board game, but didn't buy the core rules, they should be able to buy martial power and use the book for the board game. Selling a pnp rpg book supplement to a board game customer would be the ulitmate epic win for wotc, wouldn't it?Could you elaborate on prophesy's character advancement/skill learning/development? what are the similarities and differences between them and 4E's advancement?Do you think 4E's quickstart rules [the ones in the 4E starter set] are easy enough for younger people to learn, but robust enough to entertain experienced gamers?Do you think accessories such as dungeon tiles, minis, and power cards aid new and/or younger players with regards to understanding the rules?Do you think accessories [mentioned above] make the 4E game 'more fun' for younger and older, beginner and experienced gamers?</blockquote>

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