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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 7922999" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>Returning to this half a year later: You replied to me saying you had put up a new version. Because of the recent rpg.net thread I had reason to check out your latest version (called "1.6 playtest").</p><p></p><p>But I'm afraid I can't immediately see any further changes to anything we have discussed. Frankly, by now you come across as "I see your feedback, and acknowledge the validity, but won't change my mind, and can't be bothered to argue further for my position". <u>I could be wrong or misremember</u> - if so, I would <strong>much appreciate</strong> you pointing out any specific progress, ideally acknowledging which poster that made you change your mind (definitely does not have to be me).</p><p></p><p>Me and others have provided excellent feedback where you can push S&S tropes much further while not making significant (or even any!) changes to the 5th Edition core, and furthermore you have gotten several instances pointed out to you where your take on 5th edition concepts is <strong>still</strong> colored by old-edition-itis. In some instances we've also provided feedback that says "we suggest taking out this or that subsystem entirely, relying on 5E core is better and simpler!" You have AFAIK responded by saying the subsystem is optional. That still fails to acknowledge our point. Merely having a subsystem in a product brings implict recommendation; our point is that <u>taking it out</u> is the improvement we suggest, something marking it as optional fails to achieve. Please argue for keeping it in, so we can see your side of it!</p><p></p><p>While I like your product very much, and the idea of it even more, don't expect me to provide further feedback until you show yourself willing to not only discuss, but also change. You're starting to come off as somebody unable to kill your darlings here, Xoth. </p><p></p><p>Also, I noticed you <strong>still</strong> post your PDF link without regards to how others react to its cover nudity, even after extensive discussion as well as moderator action, which comes off as just sloppy by now.</p><p></p><p>I wish you good luck with your game, Xoth, but at this time you need to <em>actively work</em> to regain trust if you want the feedback implied by calling your public version a "playtest" version. Does that mean you must make changes you don't want to make just because of a random anon or three? Certainly not. But you should be able to make us see your point. That point, I'm afraid, can't and shouldn't be "because it was in my PF version" or somesuch. <em>5E is a decidedly different game.</em> </p><p></p><p>There's value in you putting your reasons for sticking to your guns into words. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>Best Regards,</p><p>Zapp</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 7922999, member: 12731"] Returning to this half a year later: You replied to me saying you had put up a new version. Because of the recent rpg.net thread I had reason to check out your latest version (called "1.6 playtest"). But I'm afraid I can't immediately see any further changes to anything we have discussed. Frankly, by now you come across as "I see your feedback, and acknowledge the validity, but won't change my mind, and can't be bothered to argue further for my position". [U]I could be wrong or misremember[/U] - if so, I would [B]much appreciate[/B] you pointing out any specific progress, ideally acknowledging which poster that made you change your mind (definitely does not have to be me). Me and others have provided excellent feedback where you can push S&S tropes much further while not making significant (or even any!) changes to the 5th Edition core, and furthermore you have gotten several instances pointed out to you where your take on 5th edition concepts is [B]still[/B] colored by old-edition-itis. In some instances we've also provided feedback that says "we suggest taking out this or that subsystem entirely, relying on 5E core is better and simpler!" You have AFAIK responded by saying the subsystem is optional. That still fails to acknowledge our point. Merely having a subsystem in a product brings implict recommendation; our point is that [U]taking it out[/U] is the improvement we suggest, something marking it as optional fails to achieve. Please argue for keeping it in, so we can see your side of it! While I like your product very much, and the idea of it even more, don't expect me to provide further feedback until you show yourself willing to not only discuss, but also change. You're starting to come off as somebody unable to kill your darlings here, Xoth. Also, I noticed you [B]still[/B] post your PDF link without regards to how others react to its cover nudity, even after extensive discussion as well as moderator action, which comes off as just sloppy by now. I wish you good luck with your game, Xoth, but at this time you need to [I]actively work[/I] to regain trust if you want the feedback implied by calling your public version a "playtest" version. Does that mean you must make changes you don't want to make just because of a random anon or three? Certainly not. But you should be able to make us see your point. That point, I'm afraid, can't and shouldn't be "because it was in my PF version" or somesuch. [I]5E is a decidedly different game.[/I] There's value in you putting your reasons for sticking to your guns into words. :) Best Regards, Zapp [/QUOTE]
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