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<blockquote data-quote="Pbartender" data-source="post: 5203078" data-attributes="member: 7533"><p>I would posit, though, that it generally depends on the group... While my players don't always do it, they're very often already "leaning in" together. In our case, it's a selfish thing, of sorts. They give hints and suggestions to the other players so their character can get a better advantage, which in turn normally benefits the group.</p><p></p><p>Down deep, it's a fundamental difference between the latest two editions... Most adventuring parties in 3E seemed to be groups of self-contained adventurers. The individuals could shine on their own. In 4E, the emphasis has shifted to the team, wherein a well coordinated group is greater than the sum of it's parts. Grokking that can make a big a difference in how smoothly the game (and especially combat) moves along.</p><p></p><p>I'm not disparaging this method (I'm sorry, if it came off that way)... I was just trying to figure out why this method made such a big difference, since mechanically speaking, there seems to be very little advantage to it. The answer is that it's more of a psychological solution, rather than a mechanical one -- It helps the players think like a team rather than individuals, it helps them pay attention between turns, and it helps stay excited about the game. Because of that, the combats move faster -- the characters are more effective, monsters die faster, players have their actions ready when their turn arrives, no one is bored and needs to be spurred into action.</p><p></p><p>That's an important thing to know, because it means that we don't always have to change the rules of the game to make it a better game. Sometimes, we just need to find a way to get into the right mind set for the game we're playing. I find that fascinating.</p><p></p><p>We made the same mental change in our group, but in a little different way. We did it by collectively building characters... The players all built their characters with feedback from the others, so that as a team their abilities and powers all complimented each other and bolstered each other's weaknesses. Now they do the same thing you mention... They each pay attention to the actions of the other players, and suggest courses of action that could set up inter-character combos.</p><p></p><p>Again, same ends, different means... </p><p></p><p>But like I said, don't get me wrong. Kudos on finding a way to make this work for your group, I'm glad it helps. As a DM, it's always awesome to see the players working together on that level. It might not work for everybody, but sharing stuff like this and discussing why it works might help someone else in the same way.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Pbartender, post: 5203078, member: 7533"] I would posit, though, that it generally depends on the group... While my players don't always do it, they're very often already "leaning in" together. In our case, it's a selfish thing, of sorts. They give hints and suggestions to the other players so their character can get a better advantage, which in turn normally benefits the group. Down deep, it's a fundamental difference between the latest two editions... Most adventuring parties in 3E seemed to be groups of self-contained adventurers. The individuals could shine on their own. In 4E, the emphasis has shifted to the team, wherein a well coordinated group is greater than the sum of it's parts. Grokking that can make a big a difference in how smoothly the game (and especially combat) moves along. I'm not disparaging this method (I'm sorry, if it came off that way)... I was just trying to figure out why this method made such a big difference, since mechanically speaking, there seems to be very little advantage to it. The answer is that it's more of a psychological solution, rather than a mechanical one -- It helps the players think like a team rather than individuals, it helps them pay attention between turns, and it helps stay excited about the game. Because of that, the combats move faster -- the characters are more effective, monsters die faster, players have their actions ready when their turn arrives, no one is bored and needs to be spurred into action. That's an important thing to know, because it means that we don't always have to change the rules of the game to make it a better game. Sometimes, we just need to find a way to get into the right mind set for the game we're playing. I find that fascinating. We made the same mental change in our group, but in a little different way. We did it by collectively building characters... The players all built their characters with feedback from the others, so that as a team their abilities and powers all complimented each other and bolstered each other's weaknesses. Now they do the same thing you mention... They each pay attention to the actions of the other players, and suggest courses of action that could set up inter-character combos. Again, same ends, different means... But like I said, don't get me wrong. Kudos on finding a way to make this work for your group, I'm glad it helps. As a DM, it's always awesome to see the players working together on that level. It might not work for everybody, but sharing stuff like this and discussing why it works might help someone else in the same way. [/QUOTE]
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