Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6066002" data-attributes="member: 42582">I'm not sure that AD&D is as loose as you posit.Yes, it's action resolution mechanics are somewhat rambling - d20s for listening at doors (unless you're a thief!), d6s for initiative, surprise and most searches (unless you're a thief!), d% for morale and evasion (and nearly everything else if you're a thief!), etc.But look at what its action resolution mechanics cover - combat, searching at and opening doors, searching for and disarming traps, morale, evasion and not much else. Then look at the XP system. And the equipment list. And the Monster Manual. And then look at Gygax's advice at the end of the PHB, on what makes for "skilled" play. And you'll see the game is actually fairly tightly focused on dungeon exploration with the operational dimension of play as the central focus.Yes, the DMG has rules for other scenarios: seafaring, aerial combat, plane-hopping etc. But those rules are pretty obviously incomplete, and I think it's telling that Gygax suggests swapping to different resolution systems, with different focuses (eg Boot Hill, Gamma World) for really satisfactory extra-dimensionsal play.If you want to play a game of political intrigue based around the economic and religious expansion of a seafaring nation (eg a fantasy version of early modern Spain or Portugal) AD&D has very little to offer you other than the CHA stat and PC archetypes. The economic rules won't really work (as the PHB explains, they're intended to capture the situation of purchasing gear at the town nearby to the megadungeon). The XP rules won't work. Your action resolution rules for sea travel, ship-to-ship combat and hand-to-hand combat are not really very good for the sorts of scenarios that will arise in this game. And you've got next-to-no social resolution rules at all. (The morale and loyalty rules don't cover the resolution of negotiations, or conversions, for example.)As for 4e, it is also pretty tight, though with a different focus of play from AD&D. But I'm curious as to what "secondary systems" you think can't be prised off. There are certainly plenty of people who use different rules for rests, for surge replenishment, and for non-combat resolution, for instance.I think it's more than just a tactical experience. It's an experience in which choices made during play matter in significant ways to action resolution - where the mattering goes both to success in the straightforward sense (eg winning the fight) but also to being able to impose your image of your PC onto the ingame situation.D&D magic-users, and to a lesser extent (though maybe in 3E the extent wasn't lesser) clerics, have always lent themselves to this. 4e generalises that element of the RPG experience to all the classes.</blockquote>

Verification