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<blockquote data-quote="Nagol" data-source="post: 5106752" data-attributes="member: 23935"><p>This is where I separate the DM and designer. The designer creates part of the story -- the situational basics that the player characters will find themselves within.</p><p></p><p>The players dictate the main part of the story by deciding what actions to attempt.</p><p></p><p>The DM, using the game rules and probability generators, knits the two together into a cohesive and plausible outcome.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Don' sell player intuition and obsevational skills short: I and several others in my group notice very quickly. Just because a DM fudges doesn't make the game unfun. It does change how I approach the game and what I expect out of it.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Whereas for me, it is the player's story to tell. </p><p></p><p>I agree everyone at the table is responsible for the group having fun -- but having fun shouldn't depend on a particular result on a particular die roll. If it does, ask yourself two questions: why is this decision being tied to a random result that can break the game? Is this the right game for the group at this time?</p><p></p><p>[Tangent]</p><p></p><p>If a game session goes south it is usually a failure of communication between DM/players or a out-of-game conflict. Sometimes its the DM. Sometimes its a player or players at the table to blame. Occasionally, the random results can get so lopsided as to be a prime cause for massive failure.</p><p></p><p>A recent session, I blame on the players. The characters found clues to an abandoned elven temple and are greeted at the entrance by a nymph who claims to occupy the grounds and invites them in. Feeling something isn't quite right (i.e. making a Sense Motive check), the players apologise and fall back. The inhabitants, recognising an adventuring band and expecting an assault, start to buff heavily.</p><p></p><p>The characters cast a <em>Divination</em> spell asking about the prospects of going into the temple. Their answer is a curt "Don't." Do the characters trust their god's message? Do they back off to discover what could possibly prompt such a straightforward command?</p><p></p><p>Of course not. They're the heroes! They'll just take extra precautions!</p><p></p><p>The battle ends when the Wizard, fearing eveyone else is lost, teleports out with the one other character in reach. Party loses 4 of 6 characters and all 3 cohorts.</p><p></p><p>The players picked the direction of the story and I don't doubt the story going forward will work through the recovery and repair of the group from the setback .</p><p></p><p>Had I fudged, the story would be different. Their god would have underestimated the heroes. The group would have escaped unscathed or won the fight and reaped the reward as opposed to losing 75-90% of its wealth and being very chastened and needing to recover.</p><p></p><p>[/TANGENT]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Nagol, post: 5106752, member: 23935"] This is where I separate the DM and designer. The designer creates part of the story -- the situational basics that the player characters will find themselves within. The players dictate the main part of the story by deciding what actions to attempt. The DM, using the game rules and probability generators, knits the two together into a cohesive and plausible outcome. Don' sell player intuition and obsevational skills short: I and several others in my group notice very quickly. Just because a DM fudges doesn't make the game unfun. It does change how I approach the game and what I expect out of it. Whereas for me, it is the player's story to tell. I agree everyone at the table is responsible for the group having fun -- but having fun shouldn't depend on a particular result on a particular die roll. If it does, ask yourself two questions: why is this decision being tied to a random result that can break the game? Is this the right game for the group at this time? [Tangent] If a game session goes south it is usually a failure of communication between DM/players or a out-of-game conflict. Sometimes its the DM. Sometimes its a player or players at the table to blame. Occasionally, the random results can get so lopsided as to be a prime cause for massive failure. A recent session, I blame on the players. The characters found clues to an abandoned elven temple and are greeted at the entrance by a nymph who claims to occupy the grounds and invites them in. Feeling something isn't quite right (i.e. making a Sense Motive check), the players apologise and fall back. The inhabitants, recognising an adventuring band and expecting an assault, start to buff heavily. The characters cast a [I]Divination[/I] spell asking about the prospects of going into the temple. Their answer is a curt "Don't." Do the characters trust their god's message? Do they back off to discover what could possibly prompt such a straightforward command? Of course not. They're the heroes! They'll just take extra precautions! The battle ends when the Wizard, fearing eveyone else is lost, teleports out with the one other character in reach. Party loses 4 of 6 characters and all 3 cohorts. The players picked the direction of the story and I don't doubt the story going forward will work through the recovery and repair of the group from the setback . Had I fudged, the story would be different. Their god would have underestimated the heroes. The group would have escaped unscathed or won the fight and reaped the reward as opposed to losing 75-90% of its wealth and being very chastened and needing to recover. [/TANGENT] [/QUOTE]
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