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<blockquote data-quote="PrometheanVigil" data-source="post: 7723758" data-attributes="member: 6703801">It's funny -- I don't see Pathfinder as complicated. It is the standard (as was 3.0/3.5 before it) from which all over tabletop RPG systems are compared with regards to complexity, variety and accessibility. There's a reason newbie gamers are still able to get into it, especially if they're stereotypically prone to giving up on it (female friends, non-nerds etc...). FFG Star Wars is the same, it's not that complicated (in fact, it's one of the better designed games so far this decade to be released, excluding the very flawed talent tree sub-system). All the 40K RPGs are badly laid out in their respective rulebooks and there's so much ill-fitting stuff in the system (although, of course, combat's pretty robust) -- it is a heavy system but only just and only because it attempts to do a lot but then not focus on or smooth out anything not related to facing or scatter graphs.Now give something as DANGEROUS as the Hero system... or something as shallow as Fate... and then you might be onto something.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="PrometheanVigil, post: 7723758, member: 6703801"] It's funny -- I don't see Pathfinder as complicated. It [I]is[/I] the standard (as was 3.0/3.5 before it) from which all over tabletop RPG systems are compared with regards to complexity, variety and accessibility. There's a reason newbie gamers are still able to get into it, especially if they're stereotypically prone to giving up on it (female friends, non-nerds etc...). FFG Star Wars is the same, it's not that complicated (in fact, it's one of the better designed games so far this decade to be released, excluding the very flawed talent tree sub-system). All the 40K RPGs are badly laid out in their respective rulebooks and there's so much ill-fitting stuff in the system (although, of course, combat's pretty robust) -- it is a heavy system but only [I]just[/I] and [I]only[/I] because it attempts to do a lot but then not focus on or smooth out anything not related to facing or scatter graphs. Now give something as DANGEROUS as the Hero system... or something as shallow as Fate... and then you might be onto something. [/QUOTE]

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