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Message: <blockquote data-quote="fanboy2000" data-source="post: 5455445" data-attributes="member: 19998">When I started playing, I wasn't "deeply invested in fantasy or history." I had never read Tolkin. Medieval Europe held no interest to me. But I liked the play style. And I'm familiar with fantasy tropes, I just wasn't big into them.So, I people had to explain what an orc was. And a few other things. I immediately gravitated to elfs and wizards.So, I think it's fairly easy.D&D? No, it doesn't. Individual DMs might. And I think that's the real problem. When DMs expect player knowledge the player doesn't have. Sometime assumptions differ among reasonable participants.I think the rules have a bigger real-world basis than their given credit for. I think part of the problem is that more things are possible in the real world than what happened in actual European history.2e. Multi-classing (I was either a half-elf thief/wizard or an elf thief/wizard. I can't remember. But I had no clue how it worked. My DM did the grunt work.) Spell selection tripped me up, I remember picking a spell called "Deep Pockets." Later my DM was talking with another player and he was mocking my choice of spell. To this day, I don't know what was wrong with it.Combat tripped me up. I had no clue how it worked. Reading the rules never seemed to help. It wasn't until 4e that I under stood the combat rules as written. With 2e and 3e, I had to actually play the game to understand it. 3.5 was better writing, I think, but it's hard to tell since I already knew what was going on by them.No, I think Soren is right. I think is missing an key ingredient in these debates thou, different expectations from different players. In my games, I handle this fairly easily. I tell all my players at the beginning of the campaign that I know nothing about real-world combat and warfare, and that I'll follow the rules rather than some notion of what real-world combat is like. If someone doesn't like that play style, it doesn't bother me that they might leave. No one's ever left, though I do hear a lot of grousing about it. I've learned to ignore it.See, this just isn't a problem for me. 2e, 3.x, and 4e have all made sense to me. As have WoD (both new and old) and even Paranoia.I'm not trying to belittle your problem. I'm simply stating that we have different expectations and assumption about what makes sense. Companies like Wizards of the Coast, Pazio, White Wolf, and Mongoose have to balance my expectations with yours.</blockquote>

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