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<blockquote data-quote="Spatula" data-source="post: 5457691" data-attributes="member: 2198">I've been thinking of this myself since playing GW. My group has some non-rules-y types, and 4e is too much for them. But GW's stripped-down rules went over decently.What I was considering stealing from GW is:* stat generation: take a 16 &amp; 14 and roll 4d6 (drop lowest) 4 times. Or an 18 and roll 5 times. this is before racial modifiers, of course.* adding your full level to everything* no feats* no stat increases with levels* flexible stats for basic attacks* some kind of innate bonus damage for critsI'm not sure about adopting the abstract equipment.Adding +level to everything entirely removes the need for &quot;plus&quot; items (+1 sword, iron armbands of power, etc.), as well as passive &quot;plus&quot; feats (expertise, focus). It also fixes all the issues with &quot;the math&quot; that crop up as characters advance in levels.I think it works perfectly with Dark Sun, as well. The characters' inherent bonuses are already included!The side effects on the game are:* Character creation becomes a snap. You might want the CharBuilder for selecting powers, but you can easily come up with the numbers right on the char sheet. And if you're using Essentials classes, you don't need the CharBuilder at all.* Characters will do more damage. Personally I consider this a feature as it cuts down on grind without the DM having to do anything.* Initiative &amp; Skill Bonuses will be a lot higher than before. This is an issue with the skill DC values, and for monsters (who are adding 1/2 level to those numbers). So maybe just add 1/2 level to those values for PCs, or revise the skill DCs and boost the monster values.* No stat increases means that class abilities/powers based off a stat value will have lesser effects. For example, a power that pushes a creature (STR mod) squares will always be stuck at the character's starting STR mod.That's off the top of my head, there might be additional issues.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Spatula, post: 5457691, member: 2198"] I've been thinking of this myself since playing GW. My group has some non-rules-y types, and 4e is too much for them. But GW's stripped-down rules went over decently. What I was considering stealing from GW is: * stat generation: take a 16 & 14 and roll 4d6 (drop lowest) 4 times. Or an 18 and roll 5 times. this is before racial modifiers, of course. * adding your full level to everything * no feats * no stat increases with levels * flexible stats for basic attacks * some kind of innate bonus damage for crits I'm not sure about adopting the abstract equipment. Adding +level to everything entirely removes the need for "plus" items (+1 sword, iron armbands of power, etc.), as well as passive "plus" feats (expertise, focus). It also fixes all the issues with "the math" that crop up as characters advance in levels. I think it works perfectly with Dark Sun, as well. The characters' inherent bonuses are already included! The side effects on the game are: * Character creation becomes a snap. You might want the CharBuilder for selecting powers, but you can easily come up with the numbers right on the char sheet. And if you're using Essentials classes, you don't need the CharBuilder at all. * Characters will do more damage. Personally I consider this a feature as it cuts down on grind without the DM having to do anything. * Initiative & Skill Bonuses will be a lot higher than before. This is an issue with the skill DC values, and for monsters (who are adding 1/2 level to those numbers). So maybe just add 1/2 level to those values for PCs, or revise the skill DCs and boost the monster values. * No stat increases means that class abilities/powers based off a stat value will have lesser effects. For example, a power that pushes a creature (STR mod) squares will always be stuck at the character's starting STR mod. That's off the top of my head, there might be additional issues. [/QUOTE]

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