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General problem with saves?
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<blockquote data-quote="ValhallaGH" data-source="post: 3571223" data-attributes="member: 41187"><p>Another thing to keep in mind is how much trouble characters that <em>aren't</em> buffed out on a single ability are in.</p><p></p><p>Honestly, though, rather than changing the spells, why don't you alter the buffs? Most of the buffs were created not to emphasize a strength but to shore up a weakness. 10 wisdom Fighters at 20th level have a +6 will save. Without magical increases, they will fail a 9th level spell will save at least 80% of the time (more if the caster has a higher than minimum ability score or other increases to the save DC). Thus, various buffs were created to allow Fighters to have an acceptable chance of success; I saw somewhere that MMO games consider a 70% chance acceptable to the majority of players.</p><p>The fact that those buffs work just as well for Wizards is a sign of poor planning, in my view.</p><p>Decrease the number of buffs available, make them less powerful, and generally lower the 'beyond the actual character' ability to avoid effects. Suddenly, those failure rates go through the roof.</p><p></p><p>Alternatively, rather than providing a +X to saves or skills, the magic can instead alter the character's total modifier to +Y. So it's not giving a +6 to will saves, it's making the character's will save into a +12, irregardless of the character's base save, wisdom score, feats or other abilities. Similarly, glibness wouldn't give a +30 to bluff, instead it would change the bluff modifier to +30 irregardless of feats, skill, Charisma or other modifiers.</p><p>This has the benefit of letting the buffs shore up weaknesses without having them maximize strengths.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ValhallaGH, post: 3571223, member: 41187"] Another thing to keep in mind is how much trouble characters that [i]aren't[/i] buffed out on a single ability are in. Honestly, though, rather than changing the spells, why don't you alter the buffs? Most of the buffs were created not to emphasize a strength but to shore up a weakness. 10 wisdom Fighters at 20th level have a +6 will save. Without magical increases, they will fail a 9th level spell will save at least 80% of the time (more if the caster has a higher than minimum ability score or other increases to the save DC). Thus, various buffs were created to allow Fighters to have an acceptable chance of success; I saw somewhere that MMO games consider a 70% chance acceptable to the majority of players. The fact that those buffs work just as well for Wizards is a sign of poor planning, in my view. Decrease the number of buffs available, make them less powerful, and generally lower the 'beyond the actual character' ability to avoid effects. Suddenly, those failure rates go through the roof. Alternatively, rather than providing a +X to saves or skills, the magic can instead alter the character's total modifier to +Y. So it's not giving a +6 to will saves, it's making the character's will save into a +12, irregardless of the character's base save, wisdom score, feats or other abilities. Similarly, glibness wouldn't give a +30 to bluff, instead it would change the bluff modifier to +30 irregardless of feats, skill, Charisma or other modifiers. This has the benefit of letting the buffs shore up weaknesses without having them maximize strengths. [/QUOTE]
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