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<blockquote data-quote="Guest 6801328" data-source="post: 6867820">Possibly because you're really not understanding this at all.&nbsp; I didn't say the character mechanically saved, I'm saying it's narrated as if she did.&nbsp; It's a world of difference.&nbsp; What you're doing is looking for ways to force the player to admit something, rather than participating in the narrative illusion.Dumb Eloelle:DM: Roll to save vs. Zone of TruthE: I failedDM: &quot;Tell me the answer to the Riddle!&quot;E: (robotically) &quot;I do not know the answer&quot;Smart Eloelle:DM: Roll to save vs. Zone of TruthE: I failedDM: &quot;Tell me the answer to the Riddle!&quot;E: Ha...I pretend to have succumbed to his trivial little spell in order to deceive him, and answer robotically &quot;I do not know the answer&quot;Exact same outcome.&nbsp; Why does &quot;Smart Eloelle&quot; offend you so deeply?&quot;My tiger's spirit is here.&nbsp; Can't you see her?&quot;&quot;I maintain a telepathic link with my tiger.&quot;&quot;Solve the puzzle yourself, I want to wallow in misery about my best friend missing.&quot;&quot;While she's gone, this little dung beetle, Novoznik, is my Temporary Best Friend&quot;Turtles all the way down, man.&nbsp; I'm not saying any of those are great examples of storytelling, but it's trivial to find workarounds.Oh, you want a simpler game.&nbsp; Yeah, it's definitely simpler to play low Int as dumb, low Str as weak, etc.But you're still incorrect that this is &quot;counter RAW/RAI stat mechanics&quot;.&nbsp; The mechanics do not change.&nbsp;&nbsp; All the changes is the narration.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Guest 6801328, post: 6867820"] Possibly because you're really not [I]understanding[/I] this at all. I didn't say the character mechanically saved, I'm saying it's narrated as if she did. It's a world of difference. What you're doing is looking for ways to force the player to admit something, rather than participating in the narrative illusion. Dumb Eloelle: DM: Roll to save vs. Zone of Truth E: I failed DM: "Tell me the answer to the Riddle!" E: (robotically) "I do not know the answer" Smart Eloelle: DM: Roll to save vs. Zone of Truth E: I failed DM: "Tell me the answer to the Riddle!" E: Ha...I pretend to have succumbed to his trivial little spell in order to deceive him, and answer robotically "I do not know the answer" [I]Exact same outcome.[/I] Why does "Smart Eloelle" offend you so deeply? "My tiger's spirit is here. Can't you see her?" "I maintain a telepathic link with my tiger." "Solve the puzzle yourself, I want to wallow in misery about my best friend missing." "While she's gone, this little dung beetle, Novoznik, is my Temporary Best Friend" Turtles all the way down, man. I'm not saying any of those are great examples of storytelling, but it's trivial to find workarounds. Oh, you want a [I]simpler[/I] game. Yeah, it's definitely simpler to play low Int as dumb, low Str as weak, etc. But you're still incorrect that this is "counter RAW/RAI stat mechanics". [I]The mechanics do not change.[/I] All the changes is the narration. [/QUOTE]

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