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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 2274318" data-attributes="member: 4937">Well, if you think that it is that simple, certainly I agree that such common sense working definitions are probably what most people go by.  While common sense has its uses, and at times is vastly superior IMO to academic sense, it isn't particular useful for looking at things below the surface.  Essentially I see the above definition as being equivelent to, "It's fantasy if I have to suspend my sense of disbelief, and its science fiction if I don't."   The problem with that definition is that it is entirely relative.   What offends your sense of realism - and is thus to you magic - might not offend someone else, and vica versa what doesn't offend your sense of realism might well offend someone else who like me finds interstellar trade empires, hundreds of native sentient species, casual FTL travel, and apparantly infinite energy sources that somehow manage not to produce waste heat to be pure bunkum. Also, you casually observe that although Star Wars has mixed elements, that it remains Science Fiction to you.  Well, where is that dividing line?   At what point does the story have enough magic in it that it becomes fantasy?   By your definitions, we ought not expect any agreement about what is science fiction and what is fantasy, in which case its kinda silly to worry about whether someone agrees with your definition or not.</blockquote>