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Getting rid of the short rest: The answer to Linear Fighter vs Quadratic Wizard?
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<blockquote data-quote="Hawk Diesel" data-source="post: 7342374" data-attributes="member: 59848"><p>This is certainly one way to accomplish getting rid of short rests. However, my concern would be the potential for players to go nova. Having characters being able to go nova makes it more difficult as a DM to balance encounters. If your players fight a boss when they are totally fresh, you suddenly have a much easier and potentially anticlimactic fight. On the other end, if they have a boss fight after exhausting all their uses, they suddenly have an exponentially more difficult fight that may in fact be impossible. This is not so much a concern for DMs that are used to adjusting on the fly, but much more difficult for DMs that rely on structuring and planning their encounters ahead of time.</p><p></p><p>Also, do you really wanna give 2nd level fighters 2-3 Action Surges per day? It is already a powerful ability to use 1/short rest, imagine if a player decided to nova with several uses in a single combat.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The one game I'm currently running is online weekday evenings. So we have more limited time (2-3 hours at most) to play. If I run more than 1 encounter a session, then all we would be doing is combat. Additionally, I would have a difficult time as the DM moving the story forward if combat was such a focus. We will go entire sessions with just RP (and as far as I can tell, everyone is still having fun and enjoying these sessions). Hopefully this helps at least in understanding my perspective as a DM.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yea, it was a house rule. I joined the game after it had started, and hadn't really been aware of that before I made my character. I wasn't a big fan of that mechanic, but it was an incredibly fun game.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm really glad you bring this up. From my perspective, every edition bring with it innovations worth considering, and problems inherent to that system. Despite all the problems of 4e, it had some really great ideas. One might argue that the 5e cantrips developed out of the at-will abilities of 4e. Also, since Matthew Colville is such a hot topic right now (I definitely backed his new Kickstarter), I think it is worthwhile to bring up his video arguing that adding elements of 4e into your game can improve it.</p><p></p><p><a href="https://youtu.be/QoELQ7px9ws" target="_blank">https://youtu.be/QoELQ7px9ws</a></p><p></p><p>I don't see the various game editions as needing to be separate entities. I also loathe those arguments that if someone suggests a mechanic from a previous edition that they should just play that edition. There are good things from every edition, and the game is modular enough for hobbyists to modify the game to suit their play style and the play style of their table. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>These are all worthwhile considerations. But it still creates this artificial idea that a person skilled enough to do something has a limit of how many times they can do it. Now this might not be everyone's take, I get that. But with magic and spells, it makes sense that you have a limited well of energy you can draw from. But if you consider classes with abilities such as the Battlemaster, how is it that they could swing a sword all day long but not be able to attempt their maneuvers with some semblance of that kind of consistency. Having per encounter abilities helps reduce that issue.</p><p></p><p>Of course, as I mentioned, it does limit or make difficult how one handles such abilities outside of combat.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That is a very interesting take. I see that it could work for games where the players are supposed to be very difficult to kill heroes of the ages. But in grittier games or games where you want your players to fear death, it could make things difficult. Of course, this is a larger critique of player death and being knocked out of combat. It's never fun to be unable to do anything in combat because you got knocked to 0 HP, but then you don't want players to not fear getting knocked to 0 because it is easy to undo it or escape the consequence. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is a very intriguing option to me. It would certainly require less modification to the game at large, while still accomplishing the initially described goal. </p><p></p><p>But I also feel like I really like the idea of encounter abilities. So maybe I need to step back and think on whether I'm personally more interested in implementing per encounter abilities, or making the rest mechanic easier to handle without impairing balance between classes/builds.</p><p></p><p>Also, what are people's thoughts about the higher level spells? Would people mind or have reservations about effectively making them more geared to once per session abilities rather than once per day?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hawk Diesel, post: 7342374, member: 59848"] This is certainly one way to accomplish getting rid of short rests. However, my concern would be the potential for players to go nova. Having characters being able to go nova makes it more difficult as a DM to balance encounters. If your players fight a boss when they are totally fresh, you suddenly have a much easier and potentially anticlimactic fight. On the other end, if they have a boss fight after exhausting all their uses, they suddenly have an exponentially more difficult fight that may in fact be impossible. This is not so much a concern for DMs that are used to adjusting on the fly, but much more difficult for DMs that rely on structuring and planning their encounters ahead of time. Also, do you really wanna give 2nd level fighters 2-3 Action Surges per day? It is already a powerful ability to use 1/short rest, imagine if a player decided to nova with several uses in a single combat. The one game I'm currently running is online weekday evenings. So we have more limited time (2-3 hours at most) to play. If I run more than 1 encounter a session, then all we would be doing is combat. Additionally, I would have a difficult time as the DM moving the story forward if combat was such a focus. We will go entire sessions with just RP (and as far as I can tell, everyone is still having fun and enjoying these sessions). Hopefully this helps at least in understanding my perspective as a DM. Yea, it was a house rule. I joined the game after it had started, and hadn't really been aware of that before I made my character. I wasn't a big fan of that mechanic, but it was an incredibly fun game. I'm really glad you bring this up. From my perspective, every edition bring with it innovations worth considering, and problems inherent to that system. Despite all the problems of 4e, it had some really great ideas. One might argue that the 5e cantrips developed out of the at-will abilities of 4e. Also, since Matthew Colville is such a hot topic right now (I definitely backed his new Kickstarter), I think it is worthwhile to bring up his video arguing that adding elements of 4e into your game can improve it. [url]https://youtu.be/QoELQ7px9ws[/url] I don't see the various game editions as needing to be separate entities. I also loathe those arguments that if someone suggests a mechanic from a previous edition that they should just play that edition. There are good things from every edition, and the game is modular enough for hobbyists to modify the game to suit their play style and the play style of their table. These are all worthwhile considerations. But it still creates this artificial idea that a person skilled enough to do something has a limit of how many times they can do it. Now this might not be everyone's take, I get that. But with magic and spells, it makes sense that you have a limited well of energy you can draw from. But if you consider classes with abilities such as the Battlemaster, how is it that they could swing a sword all day long but not be able to attempt their maneuvers with some semblance of that kind of consistency. Having per encounter abilities helps reduce that issue. Of course, as I mentioned, it does limit or make difficult how one handles such abilities outside of combat. That is a very interesting take. I see that it could work for games where the players are supposed to be very difficult to kill heroes of the ages. But in grittier games or games where you want your players to fear death, it could make things difficult. Of course, this is a larger critique of player death and being knocked out of combat. It's never fun to be unable to do anything in combat because you got knocked to 0 HP, but then you don't want players to not fear getting knocked to 0 because it is easy to undo it or escape the consequence. This is a very intriguing option to me. It would certainly require less modification to the game at large, while still accomplishing the initially described goal. But I also feel like I really like the idea of encounter abilities. So maybe I need to step back and think on whether I'm personally more interested in implementing per encounter abilities, or making the rest mechanic easier to handle without impairing balance between classes/builds. Also, what are people's thoughts about the higher level spells? Would people mind or have reservations about effectively making them more geared to once per session abilities rather than once per day? [/QUOTE]
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