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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 5719242" data-attributes="member: 53980">If the player can make a convincing argument for it, or I can think of a logical reason, then I'll let the player roll.  Since neither of those is likely to be the true in your scenario, I think this is a bit of a corner case.Above ground, movement tends to be open unless specifically constrained.  If someone is running along the sidewalk to reach a road that is an L from me, I can try running through the woods behind my house to head him off.  I may have to jump a creek and dodge a few tree branches, but a 40' wall shouldn't appear out of nowhere to prevent me from doing so.  If I really want to reach an unenclosed area above ground, chances are that I will eventually succeed.On the other hand, underground movement tends to be logically constrained unless otherwise permitted.  I can't walk through the ground to get underground.  If I want to go underground, I have to find a hole or a cave.  (Let's set aside tunneling, for the moment, as a largely impractical option.)  Just because I make an effort to gain access to a bunker, doesn't mean I will succeed.If I'm in the Dungeon of Irritation, then I know that the players have to pass through the Lavatory of Putridity and the Grotto of Unseemliness to reach the Throne Room of the Dungeon King.  A PC with History might propose to me, "Can I make a roll to see if I know whether the Dungeon King's throne room has an escape tunnel?"If his check is wildly successful, I might inform him that there is indeed a tunnel, but it isn't inside the dungeon.  Additionally, he might be aware that such tunnels weren't designed to be opened from the exit, and that the tunnel contains death traps that only the Dungeon King knew how to disable.  Note that the player doesn't have the authority to dictate the details of the tunnel; he simply has the right to ask if one exists.  If I haven't considered the question prior, and it doesn't seem impossible, I let him roll.  Because of the uncertainty of the matter.The players in the aforementioned scenario would have the option to play the dungeon as designed.  Alternately, they could leave, search for the secret tunnel, figure out a means by which to open it, and brave the traps within.  Just because there's an alternative doesn't mean you have to make it easy on them.Of course, if the Dungeon King has a phobia of secret tunnels (rebels used an escape tunnel one night to assassinate his father) then it would be illogical for him to have a tunnel and I wouldn't let the player roll.  It's all a matter of what's reasonable and plausible.  I've had the misfortune of playing with DMs whose default response was "No", and IMO that's bad DMing.</blockquote>

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