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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 8615161" data-attributes="member: 7030563">When weighing the benefits you need to consider explicitly what you are giving up with the class you are leaving and what you are getting with a new class and there are a lot more things to consider than combat, especially when you bring spells and skill-classes into the mix.Third level spells can be huge, but new 1st level class abilities can be huge to. Things like unarmored defense, expertise, strength of the grave, martial weapon proficiency and most of all spells ..... These are all pretty big buffs you can get through a 1st-level dip and it is not universally true to say 5th level abilities a single class gets are going to be better than these.Unless they multiclass into another Martial, cleric or druid it is relatively rare that martials will do double the damage at 5th compared to a 4/1 multiclass.  A melee fighter 4 with a 1-level Wizard, Sorcerer or Warlock dip will generally do roughly the same damage as an identical fighter at 5th level would do because of cantrip scaling and spell boosts.  A 4/1 Fighter-Monk and a 4/1 Fighter-Rogue is not very far behind due to martial arts and sneak attack respectively.For example a 4/1 Fighter- undead Warlock with booming blade and Hex will do the same or more damage than the same fighter at 5th level using multi attack and he can throw down the frightened condition on top of that.If I am going to multiclass it is usually before that because the character is designed to be multiclassed and by level 11 many campaigns are ending.  Even campaigns that are going to 20 you are halfway complete.Some spells upcast better than others, if you know you are going to have slots with no spells you do need to ensure you get spells that upcast well, but there are plenty that do.You also need to consider your ability score in this.  A high level spell with a save against a lower ability score is usually going to be less effective than a good upcast 1st level spell upcast with a high spell casting ability.  For example I have a 4th level sorcerer with a 13 charisma and an 18 intelligence.  Fear is a great 3rd level spell in general, but going on to 5th level for Fear with a Sorcerer DC of 12 is not going to be very effective.  The player is probably better off multiclassing to Wizard and picking up 1st level Cause Fear as a wizard and upcasting it at 3rd level with the Wizard DC of 15.If they multiclass into another caster they are actually always ahead on spells known/prepared as each class prepares a full slate of spells for their level.  The 5th level sorcerer above has 6 spells known (just counting class spells).  A 4/1 Sorcerer Wizard with 18 int has 11 Known/Prepared.</blockquote>

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