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<blockquote data-quote="Dr_Ruminahui" data-source="post: 5742640" data-attributes="member: 81104">I think you have PC math confused with creature math - creatures get an inherent +1 hit/defences with each and every level.&nbsp; PCs essentially get the same though half of it is from enhancement bonuses, feats and stat increases.&nbsp;So, yes, a level 1 kobold would essentially have a -8 to hit a level 9 PC, which is why I think that a 4 level gap is about the maximum you can get and still have them pose any kind of threat.&nbsp; Sure, they can lead the PCs into traps and pitfalls, but given that they can't actually hurt the PCs, why should the PCs bother following them - essentially, the encounter is essentially just traps with the kobolds being largely irrelevant.&nbsp;And given the 4e assumption that by default all attacks need to roll to hit.&nbsp;I do agree with your other points, though - its just with the kobolds almost never hit and almost auto hit in return, I think that its difficult to make the kobolds dicks rather than DM being one.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Dr_Ruminahui, post: 5742640, member: 81104"] I think you have PC math confused with creature math - creatures get an inherent +1 hit/defences with each and every level. PCs essentially get the same though half of it is from enhancement bonuses, feats and stat increases. So, yes, a level 1 kobold would essentially have a -8 to hit a level 9 PC, which is why I think that a 4 level gap is about the maximum you can get and still have them pose any kind of threat. Sure, they can lead the PCs into traps and pitfalls, but given that they can't actually hurt the PCs, why should the PCs bother following them - essentially, the encounter is essentially just traps with the kobolds being largely irrelevant. And given the 4e assumption that by default all attacks need to roll to hit. I do agree with your other points, though - its just with the kobolds almost never hit and almost auto hit in return, I think that its difficult to make the kobolds dicks rather than DM being one. [/QUOTE]

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