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<blockquote data-quote="Smurtis" data-source="post: 5449661" data-attributes="member: 100320">I'm not sure i agree 100%... I still believe at a very small level there is a difference between the two... Allow me to present another specific example and tell me what you think:&nbsp;Cunning Stalker Feat: You GAIN combat advantage against enemies that have no creatures adjacent to it other than yourself.&nbsp;Aversion Staff +1: You gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses against attacks made from enemies that are subject to an effect you caused.&nbsp;Question:&nbsp;If you GAIN CA from cunning stalker, do you gain the +2 item bonus for the staff property?&nbsp; I believe this to be true only if the target would be GRANTING CA... But since the effect is GAINED, you become the target, not the enemy... but your statement is suggesting that gaining and granting CA is the same, which would then suggest that since they are the same, you would gain the bonus, even though the effect targets yourself...This is why i believe that at a very fine level, the two are two seperate conditions... what do you think?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Smurtis, post: 5449661, member: 100320"] I'm not sure i agree 100%... I still believe at a very small level there is a difference between the two... Allow me to present another specific example and tell me what you think: Cunning Stalker Feat: You GAIN combat advantage against enemies that have no creatures adjacent to it other than yourself. Aversion Staff +1: You gain a +2 item bonus to all defenses against attacks made from enemies that are subject to an effect you caused. Question: If you GAIN CA from cunning stalker, do you gain the +2 item bonus for the staff property? I believe this to be true only if the target would be GRANTING CA... But since the effect is GAINED, you become the target, not the enemy... but your statement is suggesting that gaining and granting CA is the same, which would then suggest that since they are the same, you would gain the bonus, even though the effect targets yourself... This is why i believe that at a very fine level, the two are two seperate conditions... what do you think? [/QUOTE]

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