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Grappling with Mirror Image
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<blockquote data-quote="Harzel" data-source="post: 7611494" data-attributes="member: 6857506"><p>It seems clear that RAW grappling can be a one-armed hold; full body contact is not required. It seems to me that the specifics of the hold would matter only in special circumstances, usually the grappler attempting to accomplish something specific, and that would be a special adjudication. In the general case, I would assert that the precise configuration of the physical contact between the grappler and the grapplee is something that is changing moment to moment.</p><p></p><p>If the grapplee closes their eyes, then they are not affected by MI. That seems clear RAW ("a creature is unaffected by this spell if it cannot see"), and has nothing to do with being grappled or not.</p><p></p><p>If the grapplee does not close their eyes and is a creature that generally "relies on" sight, then I would rule that they are affected by MI. The exception in the spell description is for a creature that "relies on senses other than sight" and the specific example given is blindsight. To me, this means that the exception is intended for creatures that routinely use a sense other than sight as their primary (or at least a principal) sensory modality.</p><p></p><p>If the grapplee were a PC and the player pressed the case that they would surely know where at least a part of the grappler's body was, my first response would be that that is a 'realism' argument that goes beyond the simplification of the situation presented by the rules. And that is fine, but we can't cherry-pick our realism. As I noted, my view is that in general the specifics of the physical contact are changing moment to moment, and so, yes, it <em>might</em> be the case that you can draw a firm bead on the grapplers arm at a particular moment, but it is also possible that the grappler has your weapon arm partly pinned or that the grappler's arm is in a spot that you cannot effectively attack with your weapon. In general, it is more or less a wash, and that is the kind of vagary that the d20 roll covers.</p><p></p><p>If the player seemed sufficiently unhappy with that, I would offer the following: you may attack the grappler's arm without being affected by MI, but that is a "precision attack", so you have a -5 (at least) penalty to hit, and furthermore if you miss by 5 or more, then you take the damage from your attack. Also, that would go into my book as a possible behavior for NPCs when the situation is reversed.</p><p></p><p>FWIW, I can imagine a similar discussion around being grappled by an invisible creature obviating the disadvantage on the attack by the grapplee, and I think my approach to that would be analogous.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Harzel, post: 7611494, member: 6857506"] It seems clear that RAW grappling can be a one-armed hold; full body contact is not required. It seems to me that the specifics of the hold would matter only in special circumstances, usually the grappler attempting to accomplish something specific, and that would be a special adjudication. In the general case, I would assert that the precise configuration of the physical contact between the grappler and the grapplee is something that is changing moment to moment. If the grapplee closes their eyes, then they are not affected by MI. That seems clear RAW ("a creature is unaffected by this spell if it cannot see"), and has nothing to do with being grappled or not. If the grapplee does not close their eyes and is a creature that generally "relies on" sight, then I would rule that they are affected by MI. The exception in the spell description is for a creature that "relies on senses other than sight" and the specific example given is blindsight. To me, this means that the exception is intended for creatures that routinely use a sense other than sight as their primary (or at least a principal) sensory modality. If the grapplee were a PC and the player pressed the case that they would surely know where at least a part of the grappler's body was, my first response would be that that is a 'realism' argument that goes beyond the simplification of the situation presented by the rules. And that is fine, but we can't cherry-pick our realism. As I noted, my view is that in general the specifics of the physical contact are changing moment to moment, and so, yes, it [I]might[/I] be the case that you can draw a firm bead on the grapplers arm at a particular moment, but it is also possible that the grappler has your weapon arm partly pinned or that the grappler's arm is in a spot that you cannot effectively attack with your weapon. In general, it is more or less a wash, and that is the kind of vagary that the d20 roll covers. If the player seemed sufficiently unhappy with that, I would offer the following: you may attack the grappler's arm without being affected by MI, but that is a "precision attack", so you have a -5 (at least) penalty to hit, and furthermore if you miss by 5 or more, then you take the damage from your attack. Also, that would go into my book as a possible behavior for NPCs when the situation is reversed. FWIW, I can imagine a similar discussion around being grappled by an invisible creature obviating the disadvantage on the attack by the grapplee, and I think my approach to that would be analogous. [/QUOTE]
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