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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 7802380" data-attributes="member: 22779">See, the problem with this is, &quot;what is canon&quot; is a very, very slippery issue.&nbsp; You don't really get to pick and choose.&nbsp; Like it or hate it, From the Ashes IS canon.&nbsp; The Greyhawk Wars ARE canon.&nbsp; Canon simply can't be a dog whistle for &quot;stuff I like&quot;.&nbsp; We shouldn't fall into the trap of picking and choosing canon based on our personal preferences because, well, there's no actual way to go forward from that.&nbsp; &quot;Only the original boxed set is canon&quot;.&nbsp; Really?&nbsp; What about all the 1e modules, classes, races and whatnot added to the game after 1983?&nbsp; Considering the boxed set was written in 1982, would things like Forgotten Temple ofTharizdun be considered canon or not?&nbsp; Isle of the Ape comes out in 1985 and includes many iconic GH characters.&nbsp;&nbsp; Is it canon or not?&nbsp; Barbarian class?&nbsp; After all, that came out in Unearthed Arcana in 1985.On and on and on.&nbsp; We've seen it in this discussion as well.&nbsp; Some people insist on the humanocentric nature of GH.&nbsp; Me, I don't see it as much simply because many of the GH published works show non-humans working with humans.&nbsp; Sure, Saltmarsh might be a mostly human town, but, around Saltmarsh there are halfling towns (not detailed in the module).&nbsp; You have a fairly large lizard folk settlement within walking distance.&nbsp;&nbsp; There are sea elven communities within swimming distance.&nbsp; IOW, there are numerous non-human communities all in fairly close proximity.&nbsp; Is it that hard to think that there would be some trade and possible interactions between these groups?&nbsp; The lizard folk are contacting human (and non-human) smugglers to buy weapons and those humans are willing to trade.I'm not really convinced that the races are so segregated as has been presented in this thread.&nbsp; Many of the races can and do interact on a fairly regular basis.&nbsp; And, as I mentioned in my last post, so much of Greyhawk simply isn't detailed.&nbsp; You can't really definitively say, &quot;No, that's not in the setting&quot;.&nbsp; I mean, who lives on the Jetsom islands?&nbsp; AFAIK, that's not detailed.&nbsp; Nobody really lives there - there's a couple of undetailed towns and that's about it.&nbsp; More than enough space to plunk down a community of dragonborn.&nbsp; Never minding the Amedio, Hellfurnaces, or even the Dreadwood.&nbsp; There's so much blank space in the setting, that adding a semi-nomadic race of dragonpeople wouldn't actually take much work.&nbsp; While I agree that we should respect canon to a degree, canon should never be held to such a standard that changes are seen as bad, not because the change doesn't make sense or would be contradictory, but, just because it's not canon itself.&nbsp; If elements can't stand on their own, coming first doesn't matter.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 7802380, member: 22779"] See, the problem with this is, "what is canon" is a very, very slippery issue. You don't really get to pick and choose. Like it or hate it, From the Ashes IS canon. The Greyhawk Wars ARE canon. Canon simply can't be a dog whistle for "stuff I like". We shouldn't fall into the trap of picking and choosing canon based on our personal preferences because, well, there's no actual way to go forward from that. "Only the original boxed set is canon". Really? What about all the 1e modules, classes, races and whatnot added to the game after 1983? Considering the boxed set was written in 1982, would things like Forgotten Temple ofTharizdun be considered canon or not? Isle of the Ape comes out in 1985 and includes many iconic GH characters. Is it canon or not? Barbarian class? After all, that came out in Unearthed Arcana in 1985. On and on and on. We've seen it in this discussion as well. Some people insist on the humanocentric nature of GH. Me, I don't see it as much simply because many of the GH published works show non-humans working with humans. Sure, Saltmarsh might be a mostly human town, but, around Saltmarsh there are halfling towns (not detailed in the module). You have a fairly large lizard folk settlement within walking distance. There are sea elven communities within swimming distance. IOW, there are numerous non-human communities all in fairly close proximity. Is it that hard to think that there would be some trade and possible interactions between these groups? The lizard folk are contacting human (and non-human) smugglers to buy weapons and those humans are willing to trade. I'm not really convinced that the races are so segregated as has been presented in this thread. Many of the races can and do interact on a fairly regular basis. And, as I mentioned in my last post, so much of Greyhawk simply isn't detailed. You can't really definitively say, "No, that's not in the setting". I mean, who lives on the Jetsom islands? AFAIK, that's not detailed. Nobody really lives there - there's a couple of undetailed towns and that's about it. More than enough space to plunk down a community of dragonborn. Never minding the Amedio, Hellfurnaces, or even the Dreadwood. There's so much blank space in the setting, that adding a semi-nomadic race of dragonpeople wouldn't actually take much work. While I agree that we should respect canon to a degree, canon should never be held to such a standard that changes are seen as bad, not because the change doesn't make sense or would be contradictory, but, just because it's not canon itself. If elements can't stand on their own, coming first doesn't matter. [/QUOTE]

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