Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Grind-out fights, unconscious heroes, and retreat
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 6618334" data-attributes="member: 6787650"><p>First of all, I have to say that the fight you ran sounds AWESOME. Congrats to the players on winning instead of dying!</p><p></p><p>Second of all, I'd say that coming within a hairsbreadth of dying is its own punishment/reward. Do you really need to change that?</p><p></p><p>Third, I definitely do have some monsters whose goal is to grab a tasty bite to eat and then leave. Allosaurs, ghouls, mustard jellies, chain worms have all been known to be satisfied with a single kill. Sometimes that is to the PCs advantage (monster is eating your dead buddy for the next minute, which gives you time to sneak away) and sometimes it is not (you won the combat but your buddy is still dead).</p><p></p><p>Fourth, since I take gameworld physics seriously (it is a known fact to all monsters and NPCs that most wounds take less than a day to heal), winning the field is far more important to NPCs in D&D land than it is to armies in our world. There can still be pyrrhic victories, but for the most part as long as you "win" the battle, your casualties are temporary. (Death checks result in life something like 2/3 of the time, which is almost as good of a result as real-world ICU scenarios, but without any requirement to actually get casualties to the ICU.) The most common reason for my monsters to fail a morale check and run away is when the combat turns against them enough that they realize <em>we're not going to win this one, and if I die here I die for real</em>. That didn't faze your PCs, and they toughed it out and won anyway--but the average hill giant doesn't think that way. Instead of toughing it out to win the battle, he saves his own skin by running away.</p><p></p><p>As a result of the above dynamic (monsters attacking only when they think they can win), I use larger monster bands than some DMs do, but enemies also usually break at around the 50% casualty mark, at which point the PCs are often able to kill them while they're running away. (PCs are reluctant to let enemies run away successfully for some reason. It's a very human but nonetheless interesting response.) Intelligent enemies may surrender instead of running, depending on their reasons for initiating combat in the first place. So my combats are both harder and easier than vanilla combats.</p><p></p><p><strong>Conclusion:</strong> I don't think it's a problem that your PCs are willing to fight it out to the bitter end, but if you have a reason to make monsters start finishing off downed enemies, go ahead! It may or may not be smart tactics (depending on the situation) but it's certainly not unfair.</p><p></p><p>P.S. One final comment: I also use a AD&D/Speed Factor-ish initiative variant, so it's quite common for monsters not to precisely calibrate their attacks to PC hit points. If you're at 7 HP and there are three monsters attacking you, they're not going to abort their attacks the instant you hit zero HP. It's "oh, two of them hit you, for 8 and 10 points of damage apiece--that means you're at two failed death checks already." <strong>So even monsters who wouldn't deliberately waste time finishing you off might do so accidentally, due to the way initiative works.</strong></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="FormerlyHemlock, post: 6618334, member: 6787650"] First of all, I have to say that the fight you ran sounds AWESOME. Congrats to the players on winning instead of dying! Second of all, I'd say that coming within a hairsbreadth of dying is its own punishment/reward. Do you really need to change that? Third, I definitely do have some monsters whose goal is to grab a tasty bite to eat and then leave. Allosaurs, ghouls, mustard jellies, chain worms have all been known to be satisfied with a single kill. Sometimes that is to the PCs advantage (monster is eating your dead buddy for the next minute, which gives you time to sneak away) and sometimes it is not (you won the combat but your buddy is still dead). Fourth, since I take gameworld physics seriously (it is a known fact to all monsters and NPCs that most wounds take less than a day to heal), winning the field is far more important to NPCs in D&D land than it is to armies in our world. There can still be pyrrhic victories, but for the most part as long as you "win" the battle, your casualties are temporary. (Death checks result in life something like 2/3 of the time, which is almost as good of a result as real-world ICU scenarios, but without any requirement to actually get casualties to the ICU.) The most common reason for my monsters to fail a morale check and run away is when the combat turns against them enough that they realize [I]we're not going to win this one, and if I die here I die for real[/I]. That didn't faze your PCs, and they toughed it out and won anyway--but the average hill giant doesn't think that way. Instead of toughing it out to win the battle, he saves his own skin by running away. As a result of the above dynamic (monsters attacking only when they think they can win), I use larger monster bands than some DMs do, but enemies also usually break at around the 50% casualty mark, at which point the PCs are often able to kill them while they're running away. (PCs are reluctant to let enemies run away successfully for some reason. It's a very human but nonetheless interesting response.) Intelligent enemies may surrender instead of running, depending on their reasons for initiating combat in the first place. So my combats are both harder and easier than vanilla combats. [B]Conclusion:[/B] I don't think it's a problem that your PCs are willing to fight it out to the bitter end, but if you have a reason to make monsters start finishing off downed enemies, go ahead! It may or may not be smart tactics (depending on the situation) but it's certainly not unfair. P.S. One final comment: I also use a AD&D/Speed Factor-ish initiative variant, so it's quite common for monsters not to precisely calibrate their attacks to PC hit points. If you're at 7 HP and there are three monsters attacking you, they're not going to abort their attacks the instant you hit zero HP. It's "oh, two of them hit you, for 8 and 10 points of damage apiece--that means you're at two failed death checks already." [B]So even monsters who wouldn't deliberately waste time finishing you off might do so accidentally, due to the way initiative works.[/B] [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Grind-out fights, unconscious heroes, and retreat
Top