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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 5183506" data-attributes="member: 2011">In the post you quoted, I was just pointing out the current percentages and you extrapolated that to mean that I am confirming something. Hmmmm. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Unlike your assumptions about my bias, I actually voted Sometimes for me and Sometimes for my fellow players.Out of the 9 players in our group since 4E came out, I have had two players quit to go play Pathfinder instead (one of those players was in our group for 7 years and the other for 4 years, the former played 4E for over a year and the latter for almost a year before giving up on it) and one player who wants to play almost any different game system, we just don't have a DM willing to run a different game system on the day he can make it. Coincidently, that's approximately the same 3 in 10 percentage of the respondents who stated that they often experience Grind in the game. The other six players are for the most part having a good time with 4E.Granted, grind was not the only 4E issue for these three players. But, it is definitely a contributing factor.Of those 23% nevers, some fraction of them will be "this is my cup of tea and is great no matter how dragging" false positives: ie the combats that they decide are not grindy could be excrutiatingly grindy to other people.Is this false positive theory of yours confirmation bias for an opinion that you have already formed? Does it work in all directions, or are only the people who responded "often" wishy washy and unsure of their answers? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />I agree. More information is always better. Why don't you create a poll?It does seem likely, though, that we can conclude that with the current 30% of respondents stating "grind happens often for me", that approximately 3 in 10 players here see some grind issues and they see them frequently enough to respond as they did.In fact, the 37% Sometimes group is probably a spectrum that ranges from "once in a blue moon" to "once every few sessions", so we cannot just flippantly conclude that all of them are in the "once in a blue moon" category either.Bottom line: 4E grind exists to some substantial level, regardless of some people's opinions to the contrary.</blockquote>

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