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<blockquote data-quote="Stalker0" data-source="post: 8237390" data-attributes="member: 5889">Ok lets dig in to the complaint on this one:1) Unless you are hitting on a 2, the +d4 from bless is always useful, no matter what level you are at. Attack bonuses that stack with advantage are EXCEPTIONALLY rare. But honestly, the attack bonus is just the icing on the cake, its the save bonus where the meat comes in. There is almost nothing in the game that boosts your saves, and yet you have this simple 1st level spell to do the job.2) Part of the argument here is that the spell needs to be cast &quot;ahead of time&quot; to be useful, or you need knowledge of your foes. I would argue until the cleric gets spiritual guardians, what better buff spell is there to cast in general combat? And heck there are still a number of times I would use bless over spiritual guardians depending on the terrain and monsters.While there are spells I disagree on this list, I can at least see the other point of view, and can kind of go in the middle. But Bless? Bless should be on the &quot;is this spell OP?&quot; list, not the &quot;cruddy spell list&quot;. When my 20th level paladin player literally looked at his list when fighting CR 20s and said....eh you know what, I think I'll start off with bless....that should tell you something about how amazing the spell is.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Stalker0, post: 8237390, member: 5889"] Ok lets dig in to the complaint on this one: 1) Unless you are hitting on a 2, the +d4 from bless is always useful, no matter what level you are at. Attack bonuses that stack with advantage are EXCEPTIONALLY rare. But honestly, the attack bonus is just the icing on the cake, its the save bonus where the meat comes in. There is almost nothing in the game that boosts your saves, and yet you have this simple 1st level spell to do the job. 2) Part of the argument here is that the spell needs to be cast "ahead of time" to be useful, or you need knowledge of your foes. I would argue until the cleric gets spiritual guardians, what better buff spell is there to cast in general combat? And heck there are still a number of times I would use bless over spiritual guardians depending on the terrain and monsters. While there are spells I disagree on this list, I can at least see the other point of view, and can kind of go in the middle. But Bless? Bless should be on the "is this spell OP?" list, not the "cruddy spell list". When my 20th level paladin player literally looked at his list when fighting CR 20s and said....eh you know what, I think I'll start off with bless....that should tell you something about how amazing the spell is. [/QUOTE]

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