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Guns and D&D - are we doing it wrong? An alternative
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<blockquote data-quote="Hriston" data-source="post: 9285510" data-attributes="member: 6787503"><p>I like the idea of mimicking the effect of <em>fog cloud. </em>Maybe just a 5' or 10' radius cloud so as not to upstage the spell? Also, from some things I'm reading online, it would take a few shots to accumulate enough smoke for heavy obscuration, so the lower end seems right. Also, don't forget the thunderous boom effect of <em>thunderwave.</em></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm not sure when this was, considering OD&D (1974) comes with Barsoomian random encounter tables.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I've mostly included the above quotes as a jumping off point and to address the bolded claims about 2E. In fact, OD&D (1974) has the arquebus by way of <em>Chainmail </em>(where nearly all the combat rules are located)<em>, </em>and the arquebus is included on the weapon vs. armor class table in <em>Supplement I: Greyhawk </em>(1976), p 14.</p><p></p><p>In the <em>Chainmail </em>mass combat rules, "arquibusiers" [sic] ignore the armor class of their targets, scoring a hit on a d6 roll of 2, 4, or 5 or higher at short, medium, and long range respectively. They have the same range as normal crossbowmen (light crossbow in 5E) and have the rate of fire of heavy crossbowmen. They also deduct 1 or 2 points from the d6 roll for varying degrees of cover and add 1 while resting on a strong support like a wall, prop, etc.</p><p></p><p>However, on the "Individual Fires With Missiles" table (<em>Chainmail, </em>p 41) which uses the man-to-man rules, the arquebus only ignores armor up through AC 4 (leather armor + shield) having about the same chance to hit as the light crossbow vs. AC 1 or 2 (no armor and leather or padded armor)*. It also has the same probability to hit at close range (5 or higher on a 2d6 roll) as in mass combat and somewhat easier at medium and maximum ranges. Starting with AC 5 (chain, banded, studded, or splint mail), difficulty begins to increase and exceeds the difficulty of the mass combat rules at all ranges beginning at AC 6 (chain mail + shield/chain +). Nevertheless, also beginning at AC 6, the arquebus has a better chance to hit than any missile weapon at its respective ranges, except for heavy crossbow vs. AC 8 (plate armor and shield) at maximum range, which it matches.</p><p></p><p>To convert the above to 5E, I'd make it a martial weapon with something like the following stats:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">Arquebus, cost: ?, damage: 1d8 piercing, weight: 11 lb., properties: Ammunition (range 80/320), loading, two-handed, armor-piercing, smoke cloud, propable.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p><strong>Armor-piercing. </strong>When making an attack with this weapon, the target's AC is effectively reduced for the purposes of this attack by up to 3 points deriving from the target's armor and/or a shield it is wearing. Also, the weapon emits a thunderous boom audible out to 300 feet.</p><p></p><p><strong>Smoke cloud. </strong>When used, this weapon creates a 5-foot-radius sphere of smoke centered on the attacker. The sphere's area is heavily obscured. It lasts for one hour or until a wind of moderate or greater speed (at least 10 miles per hour) disperses it.</p><p></p><p><strong>Propable. </strong>Attacks made with this weapon gain advantage while the weapon is resting on a strong support (wall, prop, etc.)</p><p></p><p>I'd also add these simple weapons:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">Fire lance, cost: ?, damage: 1d6 fire, weight: 6 lb., properties: Two-handed, smoke cloud, special.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p><strong>Fire lance. </strong>When ignited as an action, this weapon emits a 10-foot cone of flame. All creatures in the area must make a DC 10 Dexterity saving throw or take 1d6 fire damage. The fire ignites any flammable objects in the area that aren’t being worn or carried.</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">Hand cannon, cost: ?, damage: 1d6 piercing, weight: 6 lb., properties: Ammunition (range 30/120), loading, two-handed, armor-piercing, smoke cloud.</p><p></p><p>*yes, <em>Chainmail </em>has ascending AC.</p><p></p><p>ETA: I'd also add this item:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>Fire arrows. </strong>When fired from a bow or crossbow, this ammunition not only deals the weapon's damage to the target on a hit, but, whether the attack hits or misses, all creatures within a 10-foot radius of the target must make a DC 10 Dexterity saving throw or take 1d6 fire damage. The fire ignites any flammable objects in the area that aren’t being worn or carried.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hriston, post: 9285510, member: 6787503"] I like the idea of mimicking the effect of [I]fog cloud. [/I]Maybe just a 5' or 10' radius cloud so as not to upstage the spell? Also, from some things I'm reading online, it would take a few shots to accumulate enough smoke for heavy obscuration, so the lower end seems right. Also, don't forget the thunderous boom effect of [I]thunderwave.[/I] I'm not sure when this was, considering OD&D (1974) comes with Barsoomian random encounter tables. I've mostly included the above quotes as a jumping off point and to address the bolded claims about 2E. In fact, OD&D (1974) has the arquebus by way of [I]Chainmail [/I](where nearly all the combat rules are located)[I], [/I]and the arquebus is included on the weapon vs. armor class table in [I]Supplement I: Greyhawk [/I](1976), p 14. In the [I]Chainmail [/I]mass combat rules, "arquibusiers" [sic] ignore the armor class of their targets, scoring a hit on a d6 roll of 2, 4, or 5 or higher at short, medium, and long range respectively. They have the same range as normal crossbowmen (light crossbow in 5E) and have the rate of fire of heavy crossbowmen. They also deduct 1 or 2 points from the d6 roll for varying degrees of cover and add 1 while resting on a strong support like a wall, prop, etc. However, on the "Individual Fires With Missiles" table ([I]Chainmail, [/I]p 41) which uses the man-to-man rules, the arquebus only ignores armor up through AC 4 (leather armor + shield) having about the same chance to hit as the light crossbow vs. AC 1 or 2 (no armor and leather or padded armor)*. It also has the same probability to hit at close range (5 or higher on a 2d6 roll) as in mass combat and somewhat easier at medium and maximum ranges. Starting with AC 5 (chain, banded, studded, or splint mail), difficulty begins to increase and exceeds the difficulty of the mass combat rules at all ranges beginning at AC 6 (chain mail + shield/chain +). Nevertheless, also beginning at AC 6, the arquebus has a better chance to hit than any missile weapon at its respective ranges, except for heavy crossbow vs. AC 8 (plate armor and shield) at maximum range, which it matches. To convert the above to 5E, I'd make it a martial weapon with something like the following stats: [INDENT]Arquebus, cost: ?, damage: 1d8 piercing, weight: 11 lb., properties: Ammunition (range 80/320), loading, two-handed, armor-piercing, smoke cloud, propable.[/INDENT] [INDENT][/INDENT] [B]Armor-piercing. [/B]When making an attack with this weapon, the target's AC is effectively reduced for the purposes of this attack by up to 3 points deriving from the target's armor and/or a shield it is wearing. Also, the weapon emits a thunderous boom audible out to 300 feet. [B]Smoke cloud. [/B]When used, this weapon creates a 5-foot-radius sphere of smoke centered on the attacker. The sphere's area is heavily obscured. It lasts for one hour or until a wind of moderate or greater speed (at least 10 miles per hour) disperses it. [B]Propable. [/B]Attacks made with this weapon gain advantage while the weapon is resting on a strong support (wall, prop, etc.) I'd also add these simple weapons: [INDENT]Fire lance, cost: ?, damage: 1d6 fire, weight: 6 lb., properties: Two-handed, smoke cloud, special.[/INDENT] [INDENT][/INDENT] [B]Fire lance. [/B]When ignited as an action, this weapon emits a 10-foot cone of flame. All creatures in the area must make a DC 10 Dexterity saving throw or take 1d6 fire damage. The fire ignites any flammable objects in the area that aren’t being worn or carried. [INDENT]Hand cannon, cost: ?, damage: 1d6 piercing, weight: 6 lb., properties: Ammunition (range 30/120), loading, two-handed, armor-piercing, smoke cloud.[/INDENT] *yes, [I]Chainmail [/I]has ascending AC. ETA: I'd also add this item: [INDENT][B]Fire arrows. [/B]When fired from a bow or crossbow, this ammunition not only deals the weapon's damage to the target on a hit, but, whether the attack hits or misses, all creatures within a 10-foot radius of the target must make a DC 10 Dexterity saving throw or take 1d6 fire damage. The fire ignites any flammable objects in the area that aren’t being worn or carried.[/INDENT] [/QUOTE]
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