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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 2629261" data-attributes="member: 2020">Thank you, Soel.  And thank you, John.  I appreciate the compliments.  Thank you very much.  Such praise, on this thread, means more to me than you might think.  The Agnakok entry gave me a set of rules upon which I could make a judgement.  I could have just said:  they became immune to everything due to their travails.  I was uncomfortable with that.  I tried to write the story within the context of the 1st and 2nd edition AD&D rules, and/or the spirit of those rules.  Go figure.  I guess conforming to the rules for the storyline was an attempt to give it more meaning and credulity.  If that was the intent, it worked for me, if not for anyone else.  These *were* AD&D elves, not ... say ... Noldorian elves or Shannara elves or Merilon elves or other types of elves.  They were AD&D elves.  So, why not use the AD&D rules regarding their storyline?  Noldorian elves, Shannara elves, and Merilon elves, would have all died after the Apocalypse.  Not because they were weaker than AD&D elves, but because the rules for them were different according to their unique authorial concepts.  AD&D elves, aided by the AD&D rules, found a way to survive their predicament.  This does not mean they were stronger elves, just that they could survive within the context of the AD&D rules.  AD&D elves, surviving within the context of AD&D rules, is a comfortable concept for me.  As for the Agnakok, the first time I read that set of rules in the Complete Wizard's Handbook, I knew I had the ultimate concept for elves.  This concept, was what made elves possible, if any concept ever did.  It is quite reasonable to rule a temperate forest one of the world's most extreme environments, IF you live within that forest without protection or any attempt at survival.  Spending your time frolicking, dancing, singing, and merry making, definitely counts as being without protection and foregoing attempts at survival (in other words, being ELVISH counts as being without protection and foregoing attempts at survival, if you define ELVISH as behaving like this.)  The elven concept and the Agnakok concept fit together so well, it's like they were made specifically for each other.  They might as well be one rule!  Agnakok = Elvish, Elvish = Agnakok.  The Agnakoks rules were just perfect for elves.    Other rules supported the Elven/Agnakok link:  elves are inherently magical, elven wizards are common, it is possible all elves are potential wizards, so it is reasonable to rule that all elves are potential Agnakoks.  Rather than just make them so, however, I wanted to create a plausible reason from the past.  I didn't want to make them superbeings (which Agnakoks are) without some form of price paid.  Where is the meaning and depth of Elvishness and their Agnakok strength, if it all just came for free?  So I made them pay.  They paid terribly.  There were 3 million at the start;  only 30,000 actually got the chance to begin the ascension to Agnakok strength.  Of those 30,000, only 3,000 made it.  And even after that, the payment went on, for being Agnakoks aided them into their long trip into insanity and depravity.   Modern elves get their Agnakok powers automatically, and for free.    Or so it seems ... and it would be true if you played them as 'normal' elves.  In that case, you the player are placing all the payment required on their ancestors, and placing none of the burden on them.  You are giving them a free pass.  If that is what you wish to do, you will have a race of superbeings that most certainly will be attractive choices as Player Characters.  If you require the elves to pay for their Agnakok strength, then the Haldendreevan Legacy is called for.  In this case, the elves eat leaves, bugs, and defeated enemies and not normal foods.  They are sadists in combat, becoming more so with each new conflict, less so with extended peacetime, even if they are nice, gentle, and 'good' people otherwise.  They can connive, scheme, politick, and backstab as they please ... but not against another elf of any kind (even if that other elf does not return the favor.)  Suddenly, the Agnakok superpeople are not so attractive as Player Characters, no?  Suddenly, the players realize that there is an E in the word Elf, and that E means Effort.  Effort to play an elf and not a human, effort to make the payments required for Agnakok level powers, effort to appreciate what elves are all about.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  The same applies to any race with strong inherent magical powers.  The githyanki come to mind here, having a painful past and severely distorted mindsets.  The drow are obvious.  The fabled yuan-ti are an example.  Minotaurs are an example.  Krynnish kender are an example, of sorts.  And what about planetouched beings?  What about undead, in those rare cases where they are Player Characters?</blockquote>

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