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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MythandLore" data-source="post: 52880" data-attributes="member: 180">As you have it, it’s not that strong at all, weak really, it could be no ECL.I would however consider why you made it the way you did compared to the Ogre.Do a kind of reverse engineering on the Ogre.Most of the power of the ogre comes from the fact that he’s large.AKA Take the large size from the ogre and you have your half ogre.Just doing a quick glance over the Ogre, he really sucks without his size.Man-O-Man does he suck!Worse then an Orc when he’s mid size.Way way weaker then a Bugbear at med size too.It’s really sad. Racial Traits: +4 Str (Ogres are +10, 8 is from size, so it should be +2)+2 Con (Ogre has +4, 4 is from size, so it should be +0)-2 Dex (Ogre has -2, 2 is from size, so it should be -0)-2 Int (Ogre has -4, so –2 is okay or you could do –4)-2 Wis (Ogre has –0 so it should be –0 too)-2 Cha (Ogre has –2 so yours looks good)· Medium-Size: As medium sized (barely) creatures, half-ogres have no special bonuses or penalties due to size. (your saying it’s Med, this looks fine)· Half-ogre base speed is 30 feet. (that’s normal for a med size and an ogre – looks fine)· Brutish Stamina: Half-ogres receive their choice of the Endurance, Great Fortitude, or Toughness feat for free at 1st level. (this makes little sense the Ogre doesn’t have anything like this)· +2 to all Intimidate, Listen, and Spot checks. (this makes little sense the Ogre doesn’t have this)· -2 penalty to Hide and Move Silently checks. (this makes little sense the Ogre doesn’t have this)· Half-ogres can use a bastard sword or dwarven waraxe in one hand without buying the Exotic Proficiencies. They still must have Martial Weapon Proficiency to do so without incurring non-proficiency penalties. (this makes little sense the Ogre doesn’t have this – if anything it would be weapon focus & proficiency in club – Ogres have great club)· Due to the broadness of half-ogres, they must pay for armor, shields, and clothing as if they were large creatures (x2 price). (this is a bad penalty for a med size race, if dwarfs don’t have a problem, he shouldn’t)· Giant: Half-ogres are considered giants for purposes of magic items, spells, feats, ranger abilities, etc. Note: Due to the diluted nature of their blood, half-ogres are considered humanoids as well as giants and as such are affected normally by all spells that specifically target humanoids. (this makes sense)· Automatic Languages: Common and Giant. Bonus Languages: Dwarf, Gnome, Gnoll, Goblin, and Orc. (I guess this works ok)· Preferred Class: None. Half-ogres lack the focus necessary to practice more than one class at a time, thus they always suffer xp penalties when multiclassing. (this is another huge penalty, I would do it, Barb would likely make sense for them)Okay here’s a quick rundown if you made the chages I just talked about.Racial Traits: +2 Str, -2 Int, -2 Cha· Medium-Size: As medium sized creatures, half-ogres have no special bonuses or penalties due to size.· Half-ogre base speed is 30 feet.· Half-ogres can use a clubs as if they are Proficiency with them and have weapon focus.· Giant: Half-ogres are considered giants for purposes of magic items, spells, feats, ranger abilities, etc. Note: Due to the diluted nature of their blood, half-ogres are considered humanoids as well as giants and as such are affected normally by all spells that specifically target humanoids.· Automatic Languages: Common and Giant. Bonus Languages: Dwarf, Gnome, Gnoll, Goblin, and Orc.· Preferred Class: BarbarianI think it would be best to make him large size and take away some of the other race features.It would make him much closer to how I think a half-ogre would be.Kinda like this:Racial Traits: · -2 Int and +8 Str, +4 Con, -2 Dex due to size.· Large-Size: As Large sized creatures.· Half-ogre base speed is 30 feet.· +2 Natural Armor due to size.· -1 AC due to size.· Can use large weapons with one hand and huge weapons with two hands due to size.· Must have Large size armor (Cost and weight Double).· Giant: Half-ogres are considered giants for purposes of magic items, spells, feats, ranger abilities, etc. Note: Due to the diluted nature of their blood, half-ogres are considered humanoids as well as giants and as such are affected normally by all spells that specifically target humanoids.· Automatic Languages: Common and Giant. Bonus Languages: Dwarf, Gnome, Gnoll, Goblin, and Orc.· Preferred Class: BarbarianI’d do something like this.But it’s up to you really, I just wanted to give you a few options to think about.There's all kinds of things you could do with Half-ogres.I do think your version is ECL+0 for sure.I think a Half-orc is probably stronger then your half-ogre and he's one of the weakest races.</blockquote>

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