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Message: <blockquote data-quote="TDarien" data-source="post: 6351152">I think what people aren't getting that there are two possible states in combat.  Either a creature knows your position, or you're hidden from it.  There isn't another possibility. This has nothing to do with whether you can be seen or not, except that, under most circumstances, in order to become hidden, you have to be out of the target's sight. If you're hidden, and your discovered (the target beats your stealth with its perception, the target moves to a position where they can see  you make a noise, or, you make an attack), your state just reverts to what is was, the target knows your position.  Nothing prevents you from hiding again, so long as you meet the requirements to hide--Not being seen or heard.  Now, when you hide, a creature knows the position it last saw you in, and if there's not a lot of places to go, it can guess pretty well where you are.  However, it can't know for sure, because you're hidden.  You could have moved somehow(if you weren't hidden it would know, because it was aware of you), but it can't be sure unless it finds your position again, (which might be as easy as moving to a place where you're not obscured anymore).The examples you give are just further exceptions. In the case of False appearance, you only need to remain motionless, not out of sight. With the spider, you can't hide from it if you're in its web.  However, they don't change the fact that you are either hidden from another creature, or it knows your position.</blockquote>

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