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<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 6866687" data-attributes="member: 177"><p>With respect, you are (probably) not a victim here. Perhaps you don't get to say what's necessary.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, we have to take that at face value, I suppose. However, if that is true, you, personally, aren't particularly representative. If men, *in general* acted without being given a rhetorical kick in the butt, then the issue would have been resolved long ago. The empirical historical evidence, however, is that a certain amount of agitation seems required to get people off their butts. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>At the moment, you are not providing *constructive* criticism. Note that, if it didn't have the strong language, we probably would not be discussing the piece, or the topic. So, what should the author have done instead, that would have been at least as effective? What else would have made Ancalagon and Rechan want to post about it instead, hm?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Actually, it does both. Look at yourself. You are not willing to engage on the issue until the hyperbolic aspect is removed, and are willing to take up the thread to argue this point. *You* are distracted, your efforts redirected. </p><p></p><p>Anyone who listens to and accepts your logical fallacy is distracted and redirected, because "not all men" is, when all is said and done, an attempt to dismiss a call to action. Anyone who wants people to engage with that call to action must, perforce, spend time dealing with the logical fallacy before we can maximize actual action. You are distracted, we are distracted, action is weakened. So, really, you're in the way. </p><p></p><p>Real people, in the real world, cannot have all things. We need to prioritize. Do you want to prioritize your own discomfiture, and that of other men? Is that the priority here?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 6866687, member: 177"] With respect, you are (probably) not a victim here. Perhaps you don't get to say what's necessary. Well, we have to take that at face value, I suppose. However, if that is true, you, personally, aren't particularly representative. If men, *in general* acted without being given a rhetorical kick in the butt, then the issue would have been resolved long ago. The empirical historical evidence, however, is that a certain amount of agitation seems required to get people off their butts. At the moment, you are not providing *constructive* criticism. Note that, if it didn't have the strong language, we probably would not be discussing the piece, or the topic. So, what should the author have done instead, that would have been at least as effective? What else would have made Ancalagon and Rechan want to post about it instead, hm? Actually, it does both. Look at yourself. You are not willing to engage on the issue until the hyperbolic aspect is removed, and are willing to take up the thread to argue this point. *You* are distracted, your efforts redirected. Anyone who listens to and accepts your logical fallacy is distracted and redirected, because "not all men" is, when all is said and done, an attempt to dismiss a call to action. Anyone who wants people to engage with that call to action must, perforce, spend time dealing with the logical fallacy before we can maximize actual action. You are distracted, we are distracted, action is weakened. So, really, you're in the way. Real people, in the real world, cannot have all things. We need to prioritize. Do you want to prioritize your own discomfiture, and that of other men? Is that the priority here? [/QUOTE]
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