Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="NotAYakk" data-source="post: 8149417" data-attributes="member: 72555">That was "improved smite", a free d8 rider paladins get at level 11.I was comparing it to a fighter that auto-hits, which starts around name level.Sure.  Forced movement and status boosts fiction units.  Tracking status and making position matter costs seconds.Ayep.  I loved disrupting strike, it really made the ranger more dynamic.Even at level 4 it can start.  Get +1 feat focus, a +1 weapon, and +2 item bonus and 20 attack stat and your static damage is already +9.If [W] is 1d8, 5[W]+9 is 31.5.3 1[W]+9 attacks is 40.5.And 4e is far more likely to give you 3 1[W] attacks than give you a 5[W] attack in heroic.  Yet the 3 1[W] attacks are way stronger.You can make a monster, and use the chart to find its CR, and it works.You cannot use the chart to determine what HP and damage you should give a monster.Because if you do that, you'll have a feature-less brute.I mean, let's play.  I want a CR 8 monster.  I'll use the CR table.[spoiler]16 AC +3 proficiency bonus 175 HP +7 ATK 53 damage per round.Give it 2 attacks.  I'll make it require 2 different targets.  The first will consume 2/3 of the budget, the 2nd 1/3.The monster will be a golem with a flaming hammer and an ice cannon on its shoulder.35 damage and 18 damage.+7 ATK means +4 strength.  SoLarge construct16 AC (armor plating)175 HP18 strengthActions:Jet Powered Flamehammer Smash: +7 vs AC, 4d10+4+2d6 fire damage (33)Ice Gun: DC 16 dex save or take 4d8 cold damage and fall prone.  The ground in a 10' radius freezes, becoming difficult terrain.Multiattack: Attack with the flamehammer, and shoot a different target with the ice gun.If we compare this to a TRex, the TRex has a similar DPR, +3 ATK, a bite that restrains, 3 less AC and 3 lower CRs of HP.That restrain is worth a lot compared to the ice gun rider above (which is mainly fluff; foes at range rarely care if they are prone or surrounded by difficult terrain; they can just stand up).3 AC and 3 ATK balance each other out.  The restrained with a high ATK bonus is worth a good boost in its offensive CR, 2 spots easily.So offensive CR 10 (+1.5 from ATK), defensive 5 (-1.5 from AC), sum to 15, average is 7.5, within 0.5 of its official 8 CR.---If you try this on non-brutes, you'll run into the problem that the extra stuff you are doing ends up dominating over the raw HP and damage and AC and stuff.A CR-first system would start off with a few templates (Artillery, Brute, Soldier, Skirmisher), have baseline stats for it, rules for special ability budgets, and how to adjust the resulting CR based on decisions.  This was how 4e worked.  The downside is that it led to a bit of uniformity in monster design.I mean, ancient dragons have legendary resists, lots of saves, lots of immunities, high AC.  These all massively boost their defensive CR.Their DPR comes from legendary actions and their attack routine and breath weapon, plus high ATK bonuses.So that CR chart is going to be way, way off what their baseline damage routine looks like, and what their HP/AC looks like....Writing a forward-instead-of-backward system isn't that tricky.  I should do it.[/spoiler]</blockquote>

Verification