Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Hate or aggro rules in 4e
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Grog" data-source="post: 3728054" data-attributes="member: 6183"><p>Well, sure - if you don't mind being surrounded by 20 armed soldiers who are likely going to cut you to ribbons on their next turn.</p><p></p><p>AoOs are not the only factors which can encourage battlefield tactics. Not even close.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No it doesn't. Combined with the full attack mechanic, it just discourages movement, period (unless you have a high enough Tumble skill to safely ignore it). When the party barbarian plops himself down next to a giant, he has <em>no incentive whatsoever</em> to move. In fact, he has a strong <em>disincentive</em> against moving. If he moves, he sacrifices his full attack, he eats an AoO for moving away, and since the giant has reach, he's going to eat <em>another</em> AoO if and when he moves back in in another round or two. His best course of action is just to stand there and swing at the giant until either he or the giant goes down.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sorry, but this is just flat-out wrong. Oh, it's true in battles between armies, but that's simply because in a big, mass battle, there isn't room to move around very much. But if you watch any kind of smaller hand-to-hand combat - boxing, martial arts, fencing, whatever - you'll see that the combatants <em>do</em> move around quite a bit, using as much of the area as they're legally allowed to. If you were to add in things like cover and high ground, movement would be even more of a factor.</p><p></p><p>Or, for a fantasy example, take Westley's fight with Innigo Montoya in <em>The Princess Bride</em>. They moved all over the ruins, used walls for cover, went up stairs, etc. Or take the big fight at the end of <em>The Fellowship of the Ring</em> movie. Aragorn didn't just stand in the same place swinging at orcs over and over again - he was moving all around the battlefield. This is what D&D combat is supposed to model, and right now, it fails miserably.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Grog, post: 3728054, member: 6183"] Well, sure - if you don't mind being surrounded by 20 armed soldiers who are likely going to cut you to ribbons on their next turn. AoOs are not the only factors which can encourage battlefield tactics. Not even close. No it doesn't. Combined with the full attack mechanic, it just discourages movement, period (unless you have a high enough Tumble skill to safely ignore it). When the party barbarian plops himself down next to a giant, he has [i]no incentive whatsoever[/i] to move. In fact, he has a strong [i]disincentive[/i] against moving. If he moves, he sacrifices his full attack, he eats an AoO for moving away, and since the giant has reach, he's going to eat [i]another[/i] AoO if and when he moves back in in another round or two. His best course of action is just to stand there and swing at the giant until either he or the giant goes down. Sorry, but this is just flat-out wrong. Oh, it's true in battles between armies, but that's simply because in a big, mass battle, there isn't room to move around very much. But if you watch any kind of smaller hand-to-hand combat - boxing, martial arts, fencing, whatever - you'll see that the combatants [i]do[/i] move around quite a bit, using as much of the area as they're legally allowed to. If you were to add in things like cover and high ground, movement would be even more of a factor. Or, for a fantasy example, take Westley's fight with Innigo Montoya in [i]The Princess Bride[/i]. They moved all over the ruins, used walls for cover, went up stairs, etc. Or take the big fight at the end of [i]The Fellowship of the Ring[/i] movie. Aragorn didn't just stand in the same place swinging at orcs over and over again - he was moving all around the battlefield. This is what D&D combat is supposed to model, and right now, it fails miserably. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Hate or aggro rules in 4e
Top