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Message: <blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 8127762" data-attributes="member: 93670">The numbers are skewed by the use of  <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spherical_cow" target="_blank">spherical cows</a>...  The evoker & cleric nova are about 30 points higher than the champion nova at just above/below 90 & 65 respectively.  The at will damage is just above 15 for cleric & about 25 for evoker while champion at will is about 25. of critical importance is that those numbers are using <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spherical_cow" target="_blank">spherical cows </a>by not using feats or magic items, both of which make a larger difference for champion due to lack of caster feats comperable to gwm & such and the fact that magic weapons add their effect to each attack so the results are pretty much going to invert with the champion taking the lead in both at will as well nova.    Variables in the champion's favor: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">If there is any chance of an attack missing or getting saved against, the champion  has multiple tries each round & only loses a fraction of possible damage that round while the caster who misses or gets saved loses a much greaterpercentage of that round's possible damage.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The chart  doesn't consider resistance in any form so now that the champion has a magic weapon he's legitimately not affected by the resist nonmagic b/p/s  creatures he hasn't been noticing since like late tier1 early tier2ish when he got that first magic weapon but the casters are affected by energy resist/energy immune & magic resist.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There are almost no creatures that are resistant to magic b/p/s  </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">DiA is a HC adventure oozing with melee centric awesome magic items including a shield with fireball truesight & more, a wand of secrets, & a +1 wand of the war mage but nearly every monster in it has sigificant energy resists/energy immunes and/or magic resist. giving an example of an already badly stacked playing field getting stacked to an almost unbelievable degree that makes "yea there are lots of monsters with those but not all of them" type arguments ring hollow.</li> </ul></blockquote>

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