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<blockquote data-quote="dave2008" data-source="post: 9558761" data-attributes="member: 83242"><p>OK, that was completely not where I thought you were going. When I heard "streamlined" I immediately thought of the stat block format. Where as what you are talking about it more the writing style IMO. I generally agree with your thoughts again, but here is some more specific feedback:</p><p></p><p>(1) Agree on this, though luckily it is not common. I created "swallowed," "dazed," and "dominated" conditions to try and address this somewhat. Curious, what do you think about the gold dragon's change to <em>Shapechange</em>? Instead of writing it all out they list the spell and then note how it is different from the spell. Takes up less space (aka more streamlined), but it requires you to know the spell Shapechange (not as DM friendly IMO). I am not sure what to think about it personally. I think it works for things that are not in combat, but I wouldn't want it for a combat/encounter ability / spell.</p><p></p><p>Also, I was recently thinking of making "throw" a standard action like push or charge. So you have the rules for throwing another creature as part of the game and then you don't need to make it a specific, lengthy action in a stat block.</p><p></p><p>Finally, how would you handle unique abilities that just need some explaining? Is your approach that if it can't be explained clearly in a sentence the trait or action should just be removed? This is making me think I need to go back and look at some 4e monsters again, they were good at making the actions fairly simple and clear.</p><p></p><p>(2) This is a difficult one for me and a lot of DMs have different desires on this front. I generally believe lower CR and creatures you expect to fight in groups should be simple and have has few traits and actions as needed to make them effective for their intended theme / role. However, I also think the answer to that is somewhat subjective. </p><p></p><p>However, I really struggle with this on BBEG's and in particular higher CR ones. Those battles should last longer and the monster needs more options IMO. I also have a tendency to design a monster around what it should be able to do and not what is efficient in game play. When I design a monster it is a living, breathing thing in my mind and I have a hard time limiting it just to make it easier to play. So I understand your concern, but I don't know if I have the will to fully embrace that approach yet.</p><p></p><p>(3) I agree the vampire is a mess. I have tried to slim it down and keep some of the intended flavor, but I usually end up filling it back up (with maneuvers or spellcasting) so it is just as long. I did remove the weakness though, as I don't think they need to be in a stat block.</p><p></p><p>However, I will push back a bit on your approach to boss monsters. I think spending time with them and understanding them is essential. I wouldn't want to design boss monsters (in general) with the requirement that they are able to be understood and run well at a glance. I think there are exceptions of course, but I wouldn't want to make that the copy/paste standard.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="dave2008, post: 9558761, member: 83242"] OK, that was completely not where I thought you were going. When I heard "streamlined" I immediately thought of the stat block format. Where as what you are talking about it more the writing style IMO. I generally agree with your thoughts again, but here is some more specific feedback: (1) Agree on this, though luckily it is not common. I created "swallowed," "dazed," and "dominated" conditions to try and address this somewhat. Curious, what do you think about the gold dragon's change to [I]Shapechange[/I]? Instead of writing it all out they list the spell and then note how it is different from the spell. Takes up less space (aka more streamlined), but it requires you to know the spell Shapechange (not as DM friendly IMO). I am not sure what to think about it personally. I think it works for things that are not in combat, but I wouldn't want it for a combat/encounter ability / spell. Also, I was recently thinking of making "throw" a standard action like push or charge. So you have the rules for throwing another creature as part of the game and then you don't need to make it a specific, lengthy action in a stat block. Finally, how would you handle unique abilities that just need some explaining? Is your approach that if it can't be explained clearly in a sentence the trait or action should just be removed? This is making me think I need to go back and look at some 4e monsters again, they were good at making the actions fairly simple and clear. (2) This is a difficult one for me and a lot of DMs have different desires on this front. I generally believe lower CR and creatures you expect to fight in groups should be simple and have has few traits and actions as needed to make them effective for their intended theme / role. However, I also think the answer to that is somewhat subjective. However, I really struggle with this on BBEG's and in particular higher CR ones. Those battles should last longer and the monster needs more options IMO. I also have a tendency to design a monster around what it should be able to do and not what is efficient in game play. When I design a monster it is a living, breathing thing in my mind and I have a hard time limiting it just to make it easier to play. So I understand your concern, but I don't know if I have the will to fully embrace that approach yet. (3) I agree the vampire is a mess. I have tried to slim it down and keep some of the intended flavor, but I usually end up filling it back up (with maneuvers or spellcasting) so it is just as long. I did remove the weakness though, as I don't think they need to be in a stat block. However, I will push back a bit on your approach to boss monsters. I think spending time with them and understanding them is essential. I wouldn't want to design boss monsters (in general) with the requirement that they are able to be understood and run well at a glance. I think there are exceptions of course, but I wouldn't want to make that the copy/paste standard. [/QUOTE]
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