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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mercurius" data-source="post: 9628750" data-attributes="member: 59082">Here's a fun one.Question: How many ancient red dragons would it take to utterly destroy Waterdeep?At first it answered 2-3, but I asked it to re-evaluate considering the presence of high level characters to defend the city. It stuck to its guns, though, and said it would take "approximately 3."[SPOILER="How many red dragons does it take to destroy Waterdeep?"]<h3>1. High-Level Defenders in Waterdeep</h3>Waterdeep is home to numerous high-level individuals and organizations that could contribute to its defense:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mirt the Moneylender : A retired adventurer (estimated level 18–20) with immense wealth and resources.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Durnan of the Yawning Portal : A legendary adventurer (level 15–18) known for his bravery and combat prowess.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The Watchful Order of Magists and Protectors : A guild of powerful wizards capable of casting high-level spells like Meteor Swarm , Time Stop , or Wish .</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Adventurers and Mercenaries : Waterdeep often hosts groups of adventurers (e.g., parties of level 10–20 characters) who could rally to defend the city.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Khelben Arunsun (if active) : A former Archmage of Waterdeep (CR 24+), whose magical might alone could rival an Ancient Red Dragon.</li> </ul>[HR][/HR]<h3>2. Re-Evaluating the Threat of Ancient Red Dragons</h3>An Ancient Red Dragon is still a devastating threat, but the presence of high-level defenders changes the dynamics significantly. Below is an analysis of how many dragons it would take to overwhelm Waterdeep under these conditions.<h4>Single Ancient Red Dragon</h4> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Initial Attack :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The dragon’s breath weapon and spellcasting could devastate parts of the city, but high-level defenders would respond quickly.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mages from the Watchful Order could counter the dragon’s spells (Counterspell ) or use powerful evocation magic (Meteor Swarm ) to retaliate.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Adventurers like Mirt or Durnan could engage the dragon directly, using tactics such as grappling, teleportation, or exploiting its vulnerabilities (e.g., targeting its underside).</li> </ul></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Outcome :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A single dragon would likely be killed or driven off by the combined efforts of high-level defenders.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Casualties: Moderate (~1,000–5,000 people), primarily in the initial attack before defenders mobilize.</li> </ul></li> </ul><h4>Two Ancient Red Dragons</h4> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Initial Attack :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Two dragons working together could split their focus, targeting different wards simultaneously.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Their combined breath weapons and legendary actions would stretch the defenders thin.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">High-level defenders might struggle to counter both dragons at once, especially if the dragons use hit-and-run tactics (e.g., flying away after attacks).</li> </ul></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Outcome :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The defenders could likely kill or drive off one dragon, but the second might cause significant destruction before being neutralized.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Casualties: Heavy (~10,000–30,000 people), with widespread damage to infrastructure.</li> </ul></li> </ul><h4>Three Ancient Red Dragons</h4> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Initial Attack :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Three dragons would overwhelm the defenders’ ability to respond effectively.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Even with high-level characters and mages, splitting resources to counter three simultaneous threats would leave gaps in the defense.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Spells like Meteor Swarm or Earthquake could annihilate entire wards, while the dragons’ flight and mobility make them difficult to pin down.</li> </ul></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Outcome :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The defenders might manage to kill one or two dragons, but the third would likely survive long enough to devastate large portions of the city.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Casualties: Catastrophic (~50,000–100,000 people), with significant portions of the city reduced to rubble.</li> </ul></li> </ul><h4>Four or More Ancient Red Dragons</h4> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Initial Attack :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">At this point, the sheer number of dragons ensures complete annihilation.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">High-level defenders would be spread too thin to stop all dragons simultaneously.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Even if some defenders managed to kill one or two dragons, the remaining dragons would systematically destroy the city.</li> </ul></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Outcome :<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Total destruction of Waterdeep, with no meaningful resistance left standing.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Casualties: Near-total (~120,000+ people).</li> </ul></li> </ul>[HR][/HR]<h3>3. Key Factors in Defense</h3> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Coordination : High-level defenders must act quickly and coordinate their efforts to maximize their effectiveness.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Resources : The Watchful Order’s access to scrolls, artifacts, and magical constructs could tip the balance in favor of the defenders.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tactics : Using spells like Forcecage , Wall of Force , or Teleportation Circle to isolate and trap dragons could give defenders a decisive advantage.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Allies : Reinforcements from nearby factions (e.g., the Harpers, Lords’ Alliance) could bolster the city’s defenses.</li> </ul>[HR][/HR]<h3>4. Conclusion</h3>With high-level defenders factored in:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">One Ancient Red Dragon : Easily defeated by the combined efforts of Waterdeep’s defenders.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Two Ancient Red Dragons : Likely defeated, but not without heavy casualties and significant destruction.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Three Ancient Red Dragons : Overwhelms the defenders, leading to catastrophic destruction.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Four or More Ancient Red Dragons : Guarantees the utter destruction of Waterdeep.</li> </ul>[HR][/HR]<h3>Boxed Answer</h3>It would take approximately 3 Ancient Red Dragons to utterly destroy Waterdeep, considering the presence of high-level defenders.[/SPOILER]I still think this is an under-estimation. Khelben Arunsun alone could take down a single red dragon, and there are conceivable several others of similar power (level 16+), plus dozens of 12-15th level, etc. Still, a fun exercise - and unless Elminster and other heroes come to the rescue, I think half a dozen would do the trick.</blockquote>

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