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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 1756234" data-attributes="member: 3146">At that point, however, the wyvern is expected to be torn up without seriously damaging the party (20% resources). Therefore the assumption that he's supposed to prevent a serious threat to the whole party (when grappling or otherwise) is inaccurate and the comparison point has to be what he accomplishes before losing.Not that it's particularly relevant. They can all hide under trees and rocks if they want but it only needs to beat one party member to have a chance of grappling him.It's probably diving and attacking from higher ground (the air one square above the victim). My SRD also lists the wyvern's attack at +10. (+13 with bonusses) That would give it a better chance--probably more like 65-70% against a two handed weapon fighter; noticably less against a sword and board fighter. Not too impressive but it's a CR 6 creature; it's supposed to get slaughtered.Actually, it's about 74% assuming the fighter has a 16 strength and is medium--both reasonable assumptions.The wyvern's 10' face makes this noticably harder--especially since the party probably doesn't begin next to the fighter. Odds are good that at least half of them have to choose between flanking and attacking. (Of course, the rogue doesn't need to flank since the wyvern is grappled).I don't know about this. In the standard 4 person party, the wizard will probably toss a magic missile (avg dmg--10.5), the cleric closes and attacks (standard atk bonus with 14 str, weapon focus and a masterwork weapon: +8 for 1d8+2 dmg--avg dmg 3.9), and the rogue attacks (16 dex, weapon finesse, masterwork rapier +8 for 1d6+1 +3d6 SA--avg dmg: 9). That's a decent chunk of hit points (total avg 23.4)  but then again, it's still less than the wyvern would have taken had the fighter had his shot (atk +11/+6 for 2d6+7 with a +1 greatsword--avg 14.7 dmg w/out power attack). Even though the rogue's average damage goes up by around six points (assuming he can only sneak attack because of the grapple) and the cleric's average damage goes up by about a quarter of a point, the wyvern is still taking less damage than it would otherwise.The fighter stands about a 26% chance of either escaping or pinning the wyvern (and since pinning is no more difficult than winning any other grapple check and a character who pins his foe can leave the grapple as a free action, there's no reason not to go for the pin).Assuming your DM allows that particular bit of rules-twisting. I wouldn't. A creature that takes the -20 to grapple is not considered grappled and therefore can't be pinned. (Only foes who are in a grapple can be pinned).Of course the rest of the party is safer once the wyvern is grappling the fighter. The fighter isn't though. And, once the wyvern takes the -20 to the grapple check, the rest of the party is actually worse off since the wyvern is not really hindered but the fighter won't be contributing to the fight until the round after he breaks out of the grapple.Note that your typical 6th level fighter only has one or two pieces of equipment that could possibly be of use in a grapple. Gauntlets of Ogre power and masterwork armor spikes are about it. If the fighter full attacked with his armor spikes the round he was grappled, he'd contribute about 3.9 points of damage--5.6 points of damage with the gauntlets. No. Actually, it shows that it is only a marginal advantage for a single creature to grab the most protected character and best grappler in a group. Had the wyvern grabbed the rogue (and followed up with a sting as it can once it starts a grapple), the equation would have looked very different. Had another wyvern engaged the rogue or the wizard at the same time, grappling would be demonstratably devastating. (Without the rogue's sneak attack or the magic missile, the wyvern cut the amount of damage it takes per round in half, negated archery (including ranged touch attacks like ray of enfeeblement or scorching ray) and area effects like glitterdust.This is grappling at its weakest, not at its strongest.Only for the people outside the grapple, only if it doesn't have constrict, and only if it is the only monster in the fight. Change any of those equations and grappling becomes A LOT more deadly.</blockquote>

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