Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Help me convince my DM that monks aren't broken
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Wyvernhand" data-source="post: 5651025" data-attributes="member: 97681"><p>False. Monks are probably the MOST item dependant class, despite their plethora of abilities. They are one of the worst classes that are impacted by VoP. VoP Monk is a trap, in that it looks good on paper, but when you put it together, really underperforms. First of all, VoP only gives you about 60% WBL, which granted, is better than no wealth, but not as good as normal wealth. Secondly, it allows for no customization. Most notably, any method of flight. On a Monk, who has no inate method of flight, that is bad (its also bad for a Fighter, Paladin, or other non-spellcaster, but thats another story).</p><p> </p><p>The main issue with Monks is their lack of focus. Someone mentioned MAD, the fact that a Monk needs 4 high stats, and even their 2 dump stats (Int and Cha) still have some significant uses. They have speed, but Flurry of Blows only functions when they stand still. They have a lot of little abilities that are neat, but ultimately aren't that relevant. Slowfall? Yay, a 1st level spell, with more limitations. SR? Too little, WAY too late. Also, affects allies buffs/heals unless you take a standard action to lower it, which leaves you vulnerable. Dim Door 1/day? ONCE PER DAY!?!?! That's certainly useful when you get fog clouded for the 2nd time that day. Immunity to Diseases? Hardly needed with all good saves and a decent Con. Become an Outsider? What monster will a 20th level Monk fight that CAN'T overcome DR/Magic? Oh, and you are no longer a valid target for Enlarge Person, a critical Monk buff. Etc. I could keep going all day.</p><p></p><p>Monks are a gilted class. They have a lot of shiney abilities that make them look "overpowered", but when you look deeper, you find out that its just worthless wood underneath.</p><p> </p><p>Contrast with Wizards. They get like, NO class features outside of 5 bonus feats and a pet. Then, when you look at how ZOMGAMAZING spellcasting is, the class is the most amazing powerful thing ever. Its the opposite with the Monk. On the tin, it looks pretty dang skippy, but reality is much less so.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Wyvernhand, post: 5651025, member: 97681"] False. Monks are probably the MOST item dependant class, despite their plethora of abilities. They are one of the worst classes that are impacted by VoP. VoP Monk is a trap, in that it looks good on paper, but when you put it together, really underperforms. First of all, VoP only gives you about 60% WBL, which granted, is better than no wealth, but not as good as normal wealth. Secondly, it allows for no customization. Most notably, any method of flight. On a Monk, who has no inate method of flight, that is bad (its also bad for a Fighter, Paladin, or other non-spellcaster, but thats another story). The main issue with Monks is their lack of focus. Someone mentioned MAD, the fact that a Monk needs 4 high stats, and even their 2 dump stats (Int and Cha) still have some significant uses. They have speed, but Flurry of Blows only functions when they stand still. They have a lot of little abilities that are neat, but ultimately aren't that relevant. Slowfall? Yay, a 1st level spell, with more limitations. SR? Too little, WAY too late. Also, affects allies buffs/heals unless you take a standard action to lower it, which leaves you vulnerable. Dim Door 1/day? ONCE PER DAY!?!?! That's certainly useful when you get fog clouded for the 2nd time that day. Immunity to Diseases? Hardly needed with all good saves and a decent Con. Become an Outsider? What monster will a 20th level Monk fight that CAN'T overcome DR/Magic? Oh, and you are no longer a valid target for Enlarge Person, a critical Monk buff. Etc. I could keep going all day. Monks are a gilted class. They have a lot of shiney abilities that make them look "overpowered", but when you look deeper, you find out that its just worthless wood underneath. Contrast with Wizards. They get like, NO class features outside of 5 bonus feats and a pet. Then, when you look at how ZOMGAMAZING spellcasting is, the class is the most amazing powerful thing ever. Its the opposite with the Monk. On the tin, it looks pretty dang skippy, but reality is much less so. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Help me convince my DM that monks aren't broken
Top