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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dandu" data-source="post: 5698003" data-attributes="member: 85158">Ice Slick forces Balance checks to move. If you are wearing heavy armor, then that is going to be a problem. If you try to jump, you either have to have that 20 ft head start to jump without penalties, or you take the penalties from a standing jump (double DC to the jump check)... which would still arguably force a balance check because you're jumping from a icy surface.Now now. Murder is its own reward.They were going in that direction anyways. It's not like I'm honor-bound to help them make the best characters evar, so I simply agreed when they started talking about how awesome the Destruction domain was. Also, was not in the mood to talk optimization with people. Having to deal with optimization arguments on the internet is enough for me. You know the feeling.Furthermore, how are suboptimal builds going to "destroy the group"? They enjoy their builds and the DM will adjust encounters accordingly so they can pass. Really, the only problem they will have is if they end up fighting an optimized enemy, which they won't do unless they perform something reallystupid. Honestly, it's a win win for everyone. They get to play characters they like, and I get an insurance policy,</blockquote>