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<blockquote data-quote="Friend of the Dork" data-source="post: 5248293" data-attributes="member: 91954">Well you can't do that at 4th level (well not without scrolls at least). With Wild Shape you can (or in 3.5, at 5th level). Also imp. invis only last for a few times, while Wild Shape lasts hours or until discontinued (3.5). And of course Fly has a very short duration too unless you're talking overland flight. Which IIRC is higher level. Are you talking about generic modifiers as described in the &quot;Beast form&quot; spell? Well they are a far cry from actual size changes. IIRC you got +8 str, +4 con etc. for going from medium to large (except where noted in spells like enlarge person). Now compare it to actually shifting into a brown bear... ouch quite a difference.BTW just read it... fairly clear that magic armor doesen't work since you don't get the armor bonus. An enhancement bonus to armor would thus be pointless (you can't have +3 magic cotton shirt in 3.75), while enhancement bonuses to natural armor would work indeed. You don't get any size changes except where noted by the spell, pretty clear (unless you're not medium or small sized). Strangely enough, if you are large and become medium you lose Con, but if you go the other way you don't gain Con... ? I couldn't find if you actually are supposed to remove your racial modifiers when you use Beast Shape(Wild Shape).If you do, halflings could gain a net +4 to str (but losing their dex bonus). Are mental stats affected at all?.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Friend of the Dork, post: 5248293, member: 91954"] Well you can't do that at 4th level (well not without scrolls at least). With Wild Shape you can (or in 3.5, at 5th level). Also imp. invis only last for a few times, while Wild Shape lasts hours or until discontinued (3.5). And of course Fly has a very short duration too unless you're talking overland flight. Which IIRC is higher level. Are you talking about generic modifiers as described in the "Beast form" spell? Well they are a far cry from actual size changes. IIRC you got +8 str, +4 con etc. for going from medium to large (except where noted in spells like enlarge person). Now compare it to actually shifting into a brown bear... ouch quite a difference. BTW just read it... fairly clear that magic armor doesen't work since you don't get the armor bonus. An enhancement bonus to armor would thus be pointless (you can't have +3 magic cotton shirt in 3.75), while enhancement bonuses to natural armor would work indeed. You don't get any size changes except where noted by the spell, pretty clear (unless you're not medium or small sized). Strangely enough, if you are large and become medium you lose Con, but if you go the other way you don't gain Con... ? I couldn't find if you actually are supposed to remove your racial modifiers when you use Beast Shape(Wild Shape).If you do, halflings could gain a net +4 to str (but losing their dex bonus). Are mental stats affected at all?. [/QUOTE]

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