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<blockquote data-quote="BryonD" data-source="post: 5250674" data-attributes="member: 957">If I made you think I'm mixing 3X with PF, I've misspoken.&nbsp; I'm talking about PF only.I'm not saying a halfling &quot;can't&quot; turn into a bear.&nbsp; only that it may be much easier for s STR18 human to turn into a bear than it is for a STR 8 Hlafling to turn into a bear.And that could be fine as well.&nbsp; But again, there needs to be both correct flavor AND some degree of balance.&nbsp; Letting the hulking human druid turn into bears earlier than the tiny halfling, while the tiny halfling can become an agile, fast, stealthy owl much more easily than the hulking human.&nbsp; To me there is some cool flavor in that trade off.&nbsp; And there is less issue with OP druids.&nbsp; Ultimately, what I REALLY think is the best idea is to use the rules as written in PF.&nbsp; I think they strike a good meeting of both flavor and balance.Then expect a good DM and a good player to work together to understand what the character can do with those abilities.&nbsp; It may be perfectly reasonable to agre that the halfling is going to be limited to a STR of 12, so any animal with a STR much higher than that isn't allowed for the character.&nbsp; In effect a house rule by mutal consent.&nbsp; Or, you can agree that wildshape is just that, a shape.&nbsp; The halfling can take the *appearance* of a bear, but not truly become a bear.&nbsp; He is bulky and big, and maybe scary looking.&nbsp; But, almost like a shadow conjuration, the forms bear muscles are not really all muscle like in a real bear.&nbsp; I completely buy the idea that wildshape is a well established cool staple of the druid.&nbsp; And messing with it is touchy.&nbsp; But the druid is well established as being way more powerful that other classes (and I am referencing 3X,not PF here).&nbsp; I think this change in PF brings that back in line.&nbsp; I'm honestly not certain if it goes too far, or not far enough because no one has run a druid in my game so far.&nbsp; But I see it as an improvement.&nbsp;&nbsp; I think the flavor can still be maintained wiht the rules as is, the expectations just need to be adjusted to more equitable levels.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="BryonD, post: 5250674, member: 957"] If I made you think I'm mixing 3X with PF, I've misspoken. I'm talking about PF only. I'm not saying a halfling "can't" turn into a bear. only that it may be much easier for s STR18 human to turn into a bear than it is for a STR 8 Hlafling to turn into a bear. And that could be fine as well. But again, there needs to be both correct flavor AND some degree of balance. Letting the hulking human druid turn into bears earlier than the tiny halfling, while the tiny halfling can become an agile, fast, stealthy owl much more easily than the hulking human. To me there is some cool flavor in that trade off. And there is less issue with OP druids. Ultimately, what I REALLY think is the best idea is to use the rules as written in PF. I think they strike a good meeting of both flavor and balance. Then expect a good DM and a good player to work together to understand what the character can do with those abilities. It may be perfectly reasonable to agre that the halfling is going to be limited to a STR of 12, so any animal with a STR much higher than that isn't allowed for the character. In effect a house rule by mutal consent. Or, you can agree that wildshape is just that, a shape. The halfling can take the *appearance* of a bear, but not truly become a bear. He is bulky and big, and maybe scary looking. But, almost like a shadow conjuration, the forms bear muscles are not really all muscle like in a real bear. I completely buy the idea that wildshape is a well established cool staple of the druid. And messing with it is touchy. But the druid is well established as being way more powerful that other classes (and I am referencing 3X,not PF here). I think this change in PF brings that back in line. I'm honestly not certain if it goes too far, or not far enough because no one has run a druid in my game so far. But I see it as an improvement. I think the flavor can still be maintained wiht the rules as is, the expectations just need to be adjusted to more equitable levels. [/QUOTE]

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