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Message: <blockquote data-quote="UHF" data-source="post: 5372312" data-attributes="member: 95672">First.. if its not your cup of tea.. why do you bother?  The first rule of 4e is, "If it isn't fun don't do it."  That seems to apply here.  Even if you drop 4e.. try to think of the things you can take from it to your other games.  (Counting squares and square explosions.. oddly makes the game more fun 'cause its easier to do. Its faster.)BalanceMost people don't get what is balanced about 4e.  The characters aren't.  What is balanced is that all the players get to participate and contribute on a relatively even level all the time.  We all participate and cheer on as the party finishes off the foe.  Even the guy gurgling his second to last breath.My last AD&D battle was cool fun epic.. we charged into a clearing full of hobgoblins.. and I got hit by a Hold Person.  I spend the next 2 hours drinking beer waiting for the fight to finish up.  Was it cool?  Did it feel real?  Hell yeah.  But it wasn't fun.Skill challenges are a means of getting all your players to solve a challenge as a group.  You can role play them or you can roll play them... its really up to the DM.Ever sat there watching as some skill laden character does all the work?  Watch him screw up by rolling low?  Wish you could help?  Want to call out an answer?Time bubbleUmm.. I've been using minis in AD&D for 30 years.  Encounter crops up... minis come out.  (Actually my current AD&D DM uses pennies.)  It is more jarring in 4e in that its all action, and they somewhat reduced the after effects.  People can role play searching the room to their heart's content if they want.  (I've spent half an hour role playing searching rooms in AD&D... was it fun?)Most parties do spend some effort cleaning up after a fight in 4e... that's no different than any older version.Powers Out of CombatDo it all the time.  Archer's Staircase is totally cool.  Want to go up a wall?  Over trap?  My other favorite is Rogue (Thievery) Bump... just hit the lock with a rock.  Given that like 80% of all modern locks can be bumped... I just like it.RitualsI'm still kind of meh on them.. I think I prefer the old spell casting way of doing things.  But having non spell users pick up the 'out of combat' stuff is just totally awesome.  I have one party without a Wizard, and the Rogue fills in for spells.  She used Water Walk just the other day.  In AD&D we'd all sit down for a day while the Cleric prayed before we could do anything.Tactical CombatI tend to agree with you on that point. 4e is very tactical... and everyone is meant to be looking for ins and outs during the fight.</blockquote>

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