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<blockquote data-quote="Krensus" data-source="post: 4377235" data-attributes="member: 59340">I don't believe anyone is claiming that the heart of the matter is that he's throwing daggers, but the attitude that he's projecting.&nbsp; There are people trying to enjoy a game and he's ruining it to prove a point.&nbsp; No one cares about that he's ineffective in combat as much as the reason that he is.I had a player try this in my first game of fourth edition.&nbsp; As I went through a basic run down of the rules, he would say &quot;that's an ok rule, maybe I'll convert it to 3.5 use,&quot; or &quot;that's just stupid, this is retarded.&quot;&nbsp; He played a wizard and intentionally picked ineffective spells or tried to showcase what he saw as flaws in the system.&nbsp; &quot;Yeah, I just cast Burning Hands and didn't get an attack of opportunity from that guy.&nbsp; This system is so dumb, I cast a spell and I don't even have to concentrate...can I make an acrobatics to see if I can backflip while casting my next spell?&quot;Once he realized no one shared his point of view, especially after playing only half of our first session, he shut up and spent his action doing nothing, causing the death of the rogue and fighter because they were overwhelmed by minions that he could have swept aside with his daily or even encounter power.&nbsp; After that game, I asked him not to return to my game.&nbsp; He was welcome to come to the 3.5 my other friend still runs or to any other social event, and we were still friends, but that I wouldn't let his attitude be the make or break for the new edition in our circle.&nbsp; Our games up until now have been great, another friend moved back into town and replaced him as a wizard.&nbsp; The mood is upbeat, and no one can wait to play until the next session, least of all me.&nbsp; We're still friends with that guy, I still see him on occasion, but he still tries to get his word in edgewise about the game.&nbsp; I think what you have to do is stop tiptoeing around the subject and say something to him about how his style of play makes you miserable and it's hurting the game.&nbsp; If you're in an area with a lot of gaming groups (I'm not), then consider moving on to another group if you cannot convince him to either leave or to discontinue his oppression.&nbsp; You'll be a lot happier and the game will either benefit from his absence or continue to go down in flames without your presence.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Krensus, post: 4377235, member: 59340"] I don't believe anyone is claiming that the heart of the matter is that he's throwing daggers, but the attitude that he's projecting. There are people trying to enjoy a game and he's ruining it to prove a point. No one cares about that he's ineffective in combat as much as the reason that he is. I had a player try this in my first game of fourth edition. As I went through a basic run down of the rules, he would say "that's an ok rule, maybe I'll convert it to 3.5 use," or "that's just stupid, this is retarded." He played a wizard and intentionally picked ineffective spells or tried to showcase what he saw as flaws in the system. "Yeah, I just cast Burning Hands and didn't get an attack of opportunity from that guy. This system is so dumb, I cast a spell and I don't even have to concentrate...can I make an acrobatics to see if I can backflip while casting my next spell?" Once he realized no one shared his point of view, especially after playing only half of our first session, he shut up and spent his action doing nothing, causing the death of the rogue and fighter because they were overwhelmed by minions that he could have swept aside with his daily or even encounter power. After that game, I asked him not to return to my game. He was welcome to come to the 3.5 my other friend still runs or to any other social event, and we were still friends, but that I wouldn't let his attitude be the make or break for the new edition in our circle. Our games up until now have been great, another friend moved back into town and replaced him as a wizard. The mood is upbeat, and no one can wait to play until the next session, least of all me. We're still friends with that guy, I still see him on occasion, but he still tries to get his word in edgewise about the game. I think what you have to do is stop tiptoeing around the subject and say something to him about how his style of play makes you miserable and it's hurting the game. If you're in an area with a lot of gaming groups (I'm not), then consider moving on to another group if you cannot convince him to either leave or to discontinue his oppression. You'll be a lot happier and the game will either benefit from his absence or continue to go down in flames without your presence. [/QUOTE]

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