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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Vicon" data-source="post: 5958458" data-attributes="member: 6696174">Hey there Everyone! First time post, but I've been reading about and I am impressed by the strength of the rulebook "kung-fu" exhibited in some of these threads. I'm getting back into D&D soon (Playing Pathfinder "Carrion Crown" -- and the last time I played D&D was 2nd edition. So I have a grasp of a lot of the concepts but it's been a LONG TIME and a LOT has changed based on what I've been finding online and in the Rulebook and APG. Basically I would like your best counsel on helping me decide between two ideas I had for Clerics domain/deity (which do you think is more powerful/fun to play/any other concerns) as well as how to not only start my character, but what is your best advice for progression choices. I was most attracted to creating a Cleric of Pharasma with Knowledge/Repose as my domains, or Desna with Luck/Good or Luck/Liberty. The Knowledge/Repose build was my first idea with the objective of trading knowledge domain for knowledge devotion and using that to gain huge bonuses against most creatures -- but as I can't seem to find Knowledge Devotion in the Core Rulebook or APG that ship may have sailed, but it still might be interesting/helpful to be the guy who (with lore keeper) can identify creatures and their powers/vulnerabilities -- either in combat with a touch attack (which seems dangerous with things like spectres) or perhaps examining things posthumously. The stagger ability in Repose (which if done to foes already staggered causes sleep) might be a useful way to help the front liners do their jobs an hopefully get coup-de-grace kills. I am starting to get the impression that even with all the knowledge skills clerics don't get enough skill points to actually be very effective in developing such broad knowledge skills. If there is a way around this or ways to mitigate it (I have to have sense motive, spellcraft, and diplomacy covered as well!)I am growing more attracted to the Desna cleric because I think Luck/Good will give me the ability to Improve the party's overall performance by providing ample re-rolls with "bit of luck" & "Touch of Good" -- I was also wondering if it was worth it to trade my "Good Fortune" to take the Fate Subdomain, as Good fortune only enables me to re-roll my own dice, whereas the Fate power (Tugging strands) would allow me to force enemies to reroll who might be landing a final blow or other badness , and thus enable me to protect the party better.I am wondering if Luck/Liberty would be better though, as starting with freedom of movement seems spiffy (enabling me to get where I need to be to buff/heal/whatever best) as well as when I get Freedom's call it would help me remedy a whole lot of conditions for the party when needed. A downside is the preferred weapons for these gods (dagger or Starknife) seem pretty lousy. If I had my way I'd be using a spiked chain, but I just don't see room for it in a build that one could call optimized. (the reach/adjacent capability seems really great, and I was attracted to the idea of tripping foes to aid the front-line in laying them out) any advice on weapon choice and how far to take them would be richly appreciated -- it would be nice if the above was attainable, or I could still use a reach weapon. I would like to function in melee as well as possible, but I want to spell cast and support the party most of all. If the skill point issue can be navigated I'd like to be able to make all those knowledge rolls to glean info for the party, and our paladin will likely end up being the face of the party, but if my diplomacy and sense motive can be high enough I'd love to be able to play that role as well, or better if logistically possible.The skills I'd like to have for either build are: Sense motive, Spellcraft, Diplomacy, Heal, Scribe Scroll, and Combat Casting (if people think I will need it)If I went the Pharasma Route I'd have to be able to pump some or hopefully as many of those knowledges to a level that would be worth it and reliable. Without Knowledge I'd still like to Have Religion and Arcana Knowledge to know (and know how to deal with) Outsiders and Undead.If you have recommendations for the best traits for the above builds I'd love to hear that too -- it would help me round out the character and save me heaps of research and cross-referencing.So I have 50 points to spend (which I realize is a lot) and I'd like to be human and be able to wear plate mail (which I realize is not the norm with clerics in pathfinder.) So beyond what your preferences for the above, how would you spec out your stats, what feats do you suggest and in what progression, and any other advice you would be so gracious to render would be infinitely appreciated! It will take me forever to learn enough to "reinvent the wheel" on what some of y'all seem to know front-to-back, and I know with proper counsel my party and I will have a much better time. Thank you for your time reading this, and especially if you have a word to throw in the hat. I've done a lot of research before posting here, but an authoritative word is worth weeks of sweat! Glad to be here,Vicon</blockquote>

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