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Message: <blockquote data-quote="gnomebarbarian" data-source="post: 2092085" data-attributes="member: 29687">Yes listen checks CAN work, but I think your DC is a little off.. First the listerner is going to be distracted (-5) there is a battle going on around them after all. and second the -10 to the listen DC for a battle is just to hear A battle not an individual person in it.   This assumes the listener doesn't know an invisible creature is in the area.  (i.e. they didn't spot the creature before it went invisible) If they already know the creatures in the area then you dont need the first roll and you just need to pinpoint the exact area. Try picking out a single instrument during a concert when 10 other people are playing the same exact instrument... (not to mention all the other instuments etc)it is hard but can be done. Throw in people singing and it gets harder. Kinda like a battle... you can hear the general noise easy enough, but filtering out specific sounds is a LOT harder to do. If they aren't using move silent then it is at min. a DC of 15 to hear a unarmed character plus 1 per 10 feet (or 10 plus 1 per 10ft for an armored character) thats assuming the DM doesn't add in more difficulty for the fight going on other then the -5 for being distracted. Most the time they will use move silent so it will be an opposed roll with the listern getting a -5 penalty (plus -1 per 10 feet again) if it was an outdoor forest type setting the person moving silent might get a minus to their roll for the conditions, but it will probaly be only a -2 in most instances. edit: then your DC to locate the precise square of 20 will also have a -5 penalty to your roll for you being distracted as well.  now if the invisible person was engaged and actually fighting someone then the -10 for being in combat would apply, but until they are actualy attacking/casting they are not in combat. for all you know they are not in the area unless you saw them go invisible but at that point its pretty easy to know the person is in the area (DC 0 most likely to hear) and getting the precise square would be all you would need to do.</blockquote>

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