Help with ramifications of becoming undead

[Miscreant]

My PC has become a Lich and I was wondering a few things. Can undead see invisible? Do undead get no modifier to fort saves since they have no con? Perhaps I am misremembering things from earlier editions but I had though undead were not affected by invisiblity and used their charisma instead of con for all things.

 

[Enamel_32]

You may want to look at Libris Mortis if you can, it explains all about the differences bewteen undead PCs and living ones.

From what I gather, undead see as they did normally in life, get no ability modifier to their fort saves, and have to be healed differently (negative energy). I'm not sure why invisibility wouldn't work, and I have no idea about which cases they would use their cha modifier instead of con.

 

[Hypersmurf]

My PC has become a Lich and I was wondering a few things. Can undead see invisible? Do undead get no modifier to fort saves since they have no con? Perhaps I am misremembering things from earlier editions but I had though undead were not affected by invisiblity and used their charisma instead of con for all things.

Unless specifically noted, undead don't see invisible. Sean K Reynolds has a rant on the subject

Undead have a Fort save modifier; they just don't get a bonus or penalty from Con. The still have a base save bonus from hit dice, and items like a Cloak of Resistance will add to their total bonus. For purposes of Fort saves, it's sort of as though they have a Con of 10, that never changes for any reason.

For certain specific things that normally use Con, undead can use their Cha modifier, but it's not a general rule.

On the other hand, it's not all that often that undead have to bother with Fort saves, since they're immune to most Fort-based effects anyway.

-Hyp.

 

[TheYeti1775]

Arent Undead immune to Illusion spells.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Arent Undead immune to Illusion spells.

No. They're immune to mind-affecting spells. Plenty of Illusions (including Invisibility) are not mind-affecting.

-Hyp.

 

[Pielorinho]

On the other hand, it's not all that often that undead have to bother with Fort saves, since they're immune to most Fort-based effects anyway.

True, although I discovered a new one tonight that I'd not previously been aware of: being blown away by high winds. (And if someone comes in here and says that, since the rules don't specifically state that high winds can target medium sized objects, undead can't be blown away by them, I'm gonna holler).

Daniel

 

[Hypersmurf]

True, although I discovered a new one tonight that I'd not previously been aware of: being blown away by high winds. (And if someone comes in here and says that, since the rules don't specifically state that high winds can target medium sized objects, undead can't be blown away by them, I'm gonna holler).

They can't be distracted by a swarm of bats, though

-Hyp.

 

[frankthedm]

Unless specifically noted, undead don't see invisible. Sean K Reynolds has a rant on the subject
-Hyp.

Link?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Link?

Link.

-Hyp.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Perhaps I am misremembering things from earlier editions but I had though undead were not affected by invisiblity ...

This confusion is not uncommon and occurs for two reasons. The first is as TheYeti1775 points out (but Hyp corrects). Though invisibility is an illusion, it is not mind-affecting. The second is that there is a spell called hide from undead (previously invisibility to undead). Some people think that this implies that a special spell is needed to make one invisible to undead. But, it's not needed.