Help with WP/VP

[takyris]

Okay, howdy, despite the icon, I know bupkus about the d20 Star Wars game. I did just get Unearthed Arcana, however, and am looking at the possibility of adding WP/VP to my D&D game. I have, as such, run into a couple of questions not addressed in UA, and I was wondering if they were addressed in SW.

How does SW handle special attacks? If a wolf attacked you in Star Wars and did VP damage, would it get to use its trip attack on you? I believe, from the occasional read-through of Star Wars boards, that if a scorpion would only poison you if it did WP damage. What about other stuff? A poisoned weapon should only deliver its poison if it does VP? What about a monk's Stunning Fist?

Basically, I understand that extra damage is always added -- sneak attack, flaming weapons, those just hurry the person up and make them have to parry more or whatever, thus doing VP damage as well as WP damage (although I'm considering nerfing Sneak Attack if it hits for WP -- does Star Wars do this?), but I'm really not sure what to do regarding attacks that rely on hitting you to force an additional secondary effect. My inclination is to say that anything that relies on hitting you only applies if it does WP damage, but I dunno if that's a huge enormous nerf on your typical D&D monster, which is CR'd with "does this extra ugly thing every time it hits in combat" in mind.

The other odd thing was that, according to UA, DR applies for both WP and VP. Is this true in Star Wars as well?

Anyway, hope this is the right thread. Thanks!

 

[DarkSoldier]

Okay, howdy, despite the icon, I know bupkus about the d20 Star Wars game. I did just get Unearthed Arcana, however, and am looking at the possibility of adding WP/VP to my D&D game. I have, as such, run into a couple of questions not addressed in UA, and I was wondering if they were addressed in SW.

How does SW handle special attacks? If a wolf attacked you in Star Wars and did VP damage, would it get to use its trip attack on you? I believe, from the occasional read-through of Star Wars boards, that if a scorpion would only poison you if it did WP damage. What about other stuff? A poisoned weapon should only deliver its poison if it does VP? What about a monk's Stunning Fist?

I believe you're correct about tripping, and you definitely are about damage-vector poisons.

The other odd thing was that, according to UA, DR applies for both WP and VP. Is this true in Star Wars as well?

No; DR only applies to wound damage in Star Wars.

 

[Starglim]

Unearthed Arcana only goes partway towards the Star Wars DR system. In Star Wars , armour does not provide a bonus to AC (except for starships, which needs fixing) and the DR values are higher.

Vitality damage can represent forceful contact or even a scrape or bruise. You still need to cause wound damage to deliver poison, but I think Improved Trip should work on a Vitality hit.

 

[takyris]

Thanks, guys -- the two rules I'm experimenting with (among others) are Armor as DR and VP/WP. Should be interesting to see how the two systems work together.

Thanks!

 

[zcthu3]

...although I'm considering nerfing Sneak Attack if it hits for WP -- does Star Wars do this...

From memory no it didn't in the original StarWars rules - but the revised rules do not have sneak attacks for any of the core classes.

I'd go with the rules in UA for sneak attacks with VP/WP which is that against VP they do bonus damage normally and against WP it does 1 point of Wound damage per die of sneak attack damage (ie. a rogue with 5d6 sneak attack does +5WP when doing WP damage).

 

[ledded]

We've used a house-ruled form of VP/WP for a year now and like it a lot.

Here is our low-down that has worked out great:

Injury poisons only work on WP damage, I believe, and that is how it works in Star Wars.

Special attacks like the wolf's trip, etc, work on vitality damage. After all, just taking vitality doesnt necessarily mean you didnt get hit at all, just hit in such a way as to not provide lasting or serious harm. So the wolf could have grabbed your pants leg instead of just ripping into your calf, and still get the VP damage + the trip. I agree, nerfing the special attacks would hose many monsters, though I would do the same thing with sneak attack that zcthu3 said (which I didnt remember from UA but sounds like a great idea anyway... we dont have sneak attack in our Modern game).

DR. Our armor in d20 Modern (and in future D&D games) provides a modest defense bonus and DR. The DR is much less than SW, and is a base of 1 for light, 2 for medium, and 3 for heavy armors. Materials, special armors, customization can provide more DR of course. This DR only applies to wound damage, i.e. when you have been hit solidly enough that the armor has some bearing. We kind of think of armor as 'cover' that you wear . Personally, I would have preferred more DR to armor and less defense, but our group went this way with it and it's worked out pretty well (since we are in d20 Modern and not many folks wear much armor anyway).

DR gained from a magic effect or from the Tough Hero's talent tree works against VP and WP damage; these are harder to get than armor and usually represent an 'all around' effect or toughness. Sure, the VP damage to the tough hero didnt skewer him, but he's tough enough that it didnt hurt his knee as much to turn out of the way. We basically didnt want to penalize people who went through a lot of trouble to get DR while trying to keep armor from outclassing the class bonuses to defense *or* becoming the be-all and end-all to protection like it is in D&D.

Just wanted to give you our lowdown on it.

We've used it and are hooked, we like it much more than static MDT saves or just plain hit points. It seems to have more flavor, plus it still keeps your tank-building characters on their toes, as a lucky hit from a bad guy can still end their day pretty quickly. It can get scary at times... a dead-on hit with a burst from a .50 cal machine gun can, and often will, kill just about any PC or NPC, which it probably should .

 

[Tellerve]

Ledded-

How did this effect KO punch and those feats?

Hmm, I'll go check the search function as well and see if I find the answer. If I do then I'll just edit this to say I'm a silly person

Tellerve

EDIT: Alright, I found some of the posts but haven't seen yet the question answered about the vp/wp and ko.