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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 6975283" data-attributes="member: 5834">The monsters aren't fine. This whole INT and WIS talk is garbage.As I said, Smaug did not have to hide. He crushed an entire dwarven city. The heroes of the story had next to no hope beating Smaug in a straight up fight, some of them were the greatest dwarven heroes of their time with the greatest wizard of their era. Yet even Gandalf and these dwarf heroes could not stand against Smaug in straight up battle. The players had to use their INT and WIS because the monster was so formidable that they had no hope against him straight. Yet here are you and guys like Flamestrike[/i] telling me how to "play them smart" and other such trash when all you're doing is proving my point. By saying, "play the monster smart" you are in essence making the PCs in the Smaug and the monsters into the person that needs to be smart about fighting the PCs.The same could be said of the Balor or Marilith. Really? That's what you picture as a great cinematic encounter? A balor being forced to play hide and seek in special terrain because if he shows his face the Sharpshooter Archer turns it into a living pincusshio with help from the smiting warlock and paladin that kill it so fast it was better off running? That's you're image of a great encounter?This is why we'll never, ever see eye to eye and why folks like you and Flamestrike continue to prove my point that monsters as written are not a very good challenge for the PCs. They have to play "smart" and use their "INT and WIS" to challenge the PCs rather than the PCs having to play smart and use their INT and WIS to beat the fearsome, destructive demonic warlord or awe-inspiring dragon. If that sits well with you, then so be it. It doesn't sit well with me. I want the dragon and balor to force the PCs to use their INT and WIS to beat them if they're sitting in a room drinking tea with the door wide open waiting for the PCs to come in. In fact, I want the Balor to want the PCs to fight him straight up because he knows that's a losing battle for them or at least a very great situation for him.I don't see why you anyone that plays this game because they love fantasy stories doesn't want the same thing. When I ask for dragons to be able to challenge the PCs without special environments or tons of minions, I don't see why that is asking too much. Why can't a dragon fly out of its lair, spot the PCs wandering about, and force them to run for cover rather than vice versa even at high level? Why can't a Balor throw itself into the middle of a group of PCs and challenge them without special help from terrain or minions and survive past a few rounds? I don't think that is asking too much, but I guess it is to some of you.Regardless, I'm going to build what I want. For me the monsters in the Monster Manual are too weak. They don't accomplish my desires in the narrative. Given that is their job, they're not accomplishing their job. I want ancient dragons that can make lvl 15 or 20 characters flee and have to work their asses off to beat them. I want balors that PCs fear to engage because they know they're in a battle to death. I want mariliths that deflect arrows and spell beams while slicing and dicing any PCs that approach them. I want the PCs scared of my monsters. I want the PCs to have to use their INT and WIS to beat the monsters regardless of the terrain or environment. The monsters in the Monster Manual are not getting it done.</blockquote>

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